gas line from hosue to workshop

[Terrian]

the existing gas pipe from the meter is (approx) 30mm (external) steel pipe, supplies gas to oven, cook top, hot water & central heater.

What I would like to have done (no, not doing it myself :) is to have mains gas down to the shed for a small hot water unit and a heater (don't want to freeze my poor old bones)

Shed to closest point of the existing gas pipe is about 20m.

Need to run water & mains power to the shed as well, was hoping to use a single trench, 300mm wide, 900mm deep (a friend has a 3.5t excavator, so little to no manual digging needed) While I am at I may as well run new 90mm stormwater as well I guess.

Location is eastern suburbs in Victoria

Anyone see any problems that might raise their ugly heads or known legalities ?

[patty]

I would opt for electric why go to the extra cost of running gas down when ya have to put electrical in anyway just make sure ya tell the sparky you want a little HWS storage unit and he will just up the size of the main. simple

[Terrian]

I would opt for electric why go to the extra cost of running gas down when ya have to put electrical in anyway just make sure ya tell the sparky you want a little HWS storage unit and he will just up the size of the main. simple

I had thought of that, if someone can point me to an electric heater that is as cheap (or cheaper) to run than a gas heater ( shed is about 35 square meters).

I also thought of running hot water from the existing water heater, but concerned about the amount of heat loss for about 25 meters of pipe.

[patty]

must be bloody cold in victoria really the only way you are going to heat your shed and keep the heat in efficiently is by insulating it and lining it you will be either too much gas or electricity you are going to find the same problem you will either use more gas or more electricty to keep the heat in... seriously one of my mates picked up an old combustion log fire 2nd hand from a garage sale that is in his shed and it works a treat and is great feature spot to kick around and ave a coupla rums on a cold winters nites as for the storage hws unit the little bastards use bugger all electricity

[Terrian]

Shed is well on the way to being well insulated (exterior walls ->sisalation -> 3.0 wall bats -> 10mm gyprock, same deal for the roof)

Back to my original question re all the services in the one trench...

[DJ’s Timber]

You can run some services in the one trench but they have to be seperate and at different depths, i.e power at 600mm gas at 900mm and water at 300mm, these figures aren't exact, just spinning them off to give you the idea.

As for what and what depth, your local council or service providers will be able to tell you this

[Terrian]

You can run some services in the one trench but they have to be seperate and at different depths, i.e power at 600mm gas at 900mm and water at 300mm, these figures aren't exact, just spinning them off to give you the idea.

As for what and what depth, your local council or service providers will be able to tell you this

thanks for that, the depth will not be a problem for the excavator :)

[chrisp]

Need to run water & mains power to the shed as well, was hoping to use a single trench, 300mm wide, 900mm deep (a friend has a 3.5t excavator, so little to no manual digging needed) While I am at I may as well run new 90mm stormwater as well I guess.

Might be worthwhile running some communications cabling as well while you are at it. Maybe a few runs of cat-5 for phone, computer, alarm system...

[Terrian]

Might be worthwhile running some communications cabling as well while you are at it. Maybe a few runs of cat-5 for phone, computer, alarm system...


have the intention of running some extra 90mm stormwater in the trench with a few runs of twine to pull extras through :-)

[patty]

ya goin the whole nine yards mate just in regards to the trench it all BS dig it 900 throw about a foot of backfill over it then gets some warning tape available at any elect wholesaler and back fill the rest i have dug many a trench and we all threw it in the hole but i always made sure power was on the bottom i would rather hit phone water or gas before hitting power and be done with it

[Terrian]

ya goin the whole nine yards mate just in regards to the trench it all BS dig it 900 throw about a foot of backfill over it then gets some warning tape available at any elect wholesaler and back fill the rest i have dug many a trench and we all threw it in the hole but i always made sure power was on the bottom i would rather hit phone water or gas before hitting power and be done with it

yep, to the garden shed I dug a 700mm deep 12m long trench, power cable in thick walled poly pipe, 100mm dirt, safety tape, filled in the trench. Trench is about 700mm from the fence (no garden bed).

From asking around the depth for power is min 600mm, gas seems to be min 450mm. As I said, access to an excavator so going deeper is not a problem.

[Bleedin Thumb]

I always thought that gas and power were not allowed in the same trench?
Might be a NSW thing or I may be wrong..

[patty]

mate ya only kiddin me about using poly pipe to carry the power arnt ya? you are going to use heavy duty conduit correct!

[Tools]

In vic there is no regulation for the distance of power to gas pipe.But, there is a reg for the distance of gas to power.It is either 300 or 450...can't recall now.

Tools

[patty]

Are you talking about distance from the point of ignition now or what?

[dazzler]

Doesnt help none but I just love a wood fire in the shed.

Helps cover up mistakes as well.:D

[patty]

for example we are on bottled gas here and I could not have the gas bottles alongside my outdoor split system airconditoner that I purposely poured a slab to accomodate the bottles, as it was within the point of ignition allowable range i think but might be corrected is 1.2 mtrs but inside where you have the gas bayonets in the house you can have a power point right next to them and there is no restrictions what is the go there also,over the years i installed mains power to houses and the gas fella puts his pipe in the same trench and the gas meter is located directly below the switchboard? Is there any gasfitters out there who can clarify the regulations on this

[wonderplumb]

I had thought of that, if someone can point me to an electric heater that is as cheap (or cheaper) to run than a gas heater ( shed is about 35 square meters).

I also thought of running hot water from the existing water heater, but concerned about the amount of heat loss for about 25 meters of pipe.
Mate you would be better off using a little 25litre plug in job that goes under the sink, assuming you only want it for washing up. Running gas that far for a space heater and HWS you may have to increase the size of the WHOLE gas service from the meter, and may have to increase the size of the meter itself. As it sounds you may have the original gas service working flat out already, it all depends on available pressure, lineal lenght of pipework and megajoule ratings of all fixtures. Hope this has been a help.

[wonderplumb]

for example we are on bottled gas here and I could not have the gas bottles alongside my outdoor split system airconditoner that I purposely poured a slab to accomodate the bottles, as it was within the point of ignition allowable range i think but might be corrected is 1.2 mtrs but inside where you have the gas bayonets in the house you can have a power point right next to them and there is no restrictions what is the go there also,over the years i installed mains power to houses and the gas fella puts his pipe in the same trench and the gas meter is located directly below the switchboard? Is there any gasfitters out there who can clarify the regulations on this
Ignition source not within 1500mm of exchange bottles and 3500mm for in-situ fill bottles
No dramas under a switch board but it states that you need a minimum clearance above it for seviceing, 500mm I think and as long as it meets venting requirements.
In a trench a gas pipe needs 100mm clearance from an electrical conduit provided the conduit is marked along its lenght otherwise its 300mm.
As far as bayonet fittings go common sense prevails here, the question had me stumped but I couldnt find anything in the "Bible". Though most modern heaters need power anyhow so you wouldnt place a bayonet fitting on the opposite side of the room to the GPO.

[Terrian]

mate ya only kiddin me about using poly pipe to carry the power arnt ya? you are going to use heavy duty conduit correct!

nope, I ran the poly with orange conduit inside that, for the power to the new shed I will be using just the orange conduit. (poly is about 2" diameter, wall thickness is about 5mm)

[Terrian]

Mate you would be better off using a little 25litre plug in job that goes under the sink, assuming you only want it for washing up. Running gas that far for a space heater and HWS you may have to increase the size of the WHOLE gas service from the meter, and may have to increase the size of the meter itself. As it sounds you may have the original gas service working flat out already, it all depends on available pressure, lineal lenght of pipework and megajoule ratings of all fixtures. Hope this has been a help.

gas meter was replaced about 8 years ago, the *metal pipe running from that is a little over 1" OD, the heater, HWS & oven / cooktop are connected via 1/2" copper

the origianl 90-4star rated HWS (and I mean origianl, as in almost 30 years old) was replaced with a 135lt about 9 years ago, the -5star central heating unit is being replaced with a 4 or 5 star unit this year.

I will check the ratings of the current heating unit, we did notice a drop in the gas bill after the new HWS went in. The meter should have a rating on it somewhere as well, right ?

Thanks for the reply


*looks like 1" 1/4 OD gal water pipe to my untrained eye

[patty]

cheers wonderplumb your a wealth of information

[wonderplumb]

Yeah the meter itself will have a rating in cubic metres p/h and the regulator will have and outlet pressure written on it or on a sticker, usually 1.38kPa or 2.75kPa. Without looking at the pipe it sounds like it would be either 3/4nb or 1"nb gal. If it is 1" gal you may be ok, but as I understand VIC has some pretty tough rules on gas, we all follow the same australian standard but each state has a governing body which has its own standards, and therefore overrides the AS5601. I also know that VIC is pretty critical on where gas space heaters are placed, I dont know the size of your shed but it may be too small an area. Im only throwing suggestions out here mate to give you a heads up but please consult your local gasfitter, as I cant quote victorian specific rules.