Doorstops? Simple? HA! :(

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

So I'm doing the finishing touches to a place I've been working on for some time,and the owner has asked me to install some doorstops. Simple, right! Wishful thinking!

Now, when I first started on this site a few years ago, it had just been framed out (sorta) and the framer had been given the flick (which is why I was originally called in) because he'd laid all the floor bearers down on their sides. :eek: Unfortunately, this wasn't picked up until the inspector was called out... by which time the brickwork had been finished, wall frames & trusses installed, etc., etc.

ie. it wasn't a case of an easy fix. (Solved by adding extra stumps, but let's not go there.)

What has this got to do with doorstops? OK, I'm getting to that... the brickwork went in properly, according to plan, right? The floor is an inch lower, 'cos the bearers were laid FUBAR. So this means the door sills are an 1" too high, because they're position is matched to the brickwork. Fortunately, the owner was happy with a bit of quad to "ramp 'em down," one less headache for me [phew], but...

Both the front and back doors are doubles and the owner doesn't want the doors to swing back to the walls, he's asked for 'em to be stopped at just beyond perpendicular. The higher sill means much higher floor clearance than usual, I'd say 1.5"-2", which makes all the commercial floor-mount doorstops I can find useless. He veto'd my idea of simply using wooden blocks... and I don't blame him. (I was trying to weasel out of yet another headache. ;))

So, I'm racking my brain. One idea I've come up with is to use a kick-board mounted type (see pic) and replace the ####ty little screw with a nut'n'bolt as I've done in the pic so I can bolt it through the floor instead. I'm concerned about leverage though... modern floorboards are pretty thin nowadays and I reckon a good slam of the door onto a stop mounted like this could do some serious damage. :(

I've been thinking about turning some round disks about 3" dia. x 1" high (probably domed) and drill them out to fit snugly over the stop. Screw these down to the floor, plugged & trimmed with dowel, and pray they add enough extra lateral support at the base of the stop. Hopefully they'll look good too. [fingers Xed]

Opinions? Criticisms? Flaws? Better ideas? Please?

[ozwinner]

because he'd laid all the floor bearers down on their sides. :eek:


What?? :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

No wonder the average fella thinks all tradies are bastards!!

Al :eek:

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Mates & in-laws are the worst choice of tradies for your own home.

Just ask Mick... I'm sure hell agree! :D

[Auld Bassoon]

Hi Skew,

I know half of stuff-all on framing, floorboarding etc, but why should that stop me? :D

From the height of your proposed door stop, I'd imagine that there'd be quite a lot of leverage acting on the mounting bolt.

Is it possible to gain access under the floorboards in the areas in question and mount a flat metal support so as to spread the load across, say 150x150mm, instead of a single point?

As an alternative, what about a stop that is wall mounted?

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

From the height of your proposed door stop, I'd imagine that there'd be quite a lot of leverage acting on the mounting bolt.

Is it possible to gain access under the floorboards in the areas in question and mount a flat metal support so as to spread the load across, say 150x150mm, instead of a single point?

My concern exactly. I was thinking of making up some large washers, but you're right; the larger the better. I'd have to make an expedition under the house to tighten the nuts anyway (I reckon I know every mud-hole under there better than I know my own face! [sigh]) and I don't want to be called back, so methinks I'll see about knocking some good sized plates up instead. In this case, overkill = a good thing. ;)

Thanks for the nudge. :)


As an alternative, what about a stop that is wall mounted?

I wish it was that simple; he doesn't want the doors swinging to the walls, they'll be stopped at just past 90° open.

[Tankstand]

As an alternative, what about a stop that is wall mounted?

Could they each be stopped at the very top with a decorative little jobbie that doubles as a shelf for twig pots etc.?

[pawnhead]

I'd say that you've got the only solution, short of installing a door closer that holds in the open position. Why is it so important that the door doesn't swing back past perpendicular? If you mounted that door stop horizontally on the wall the way it's supposed to be installed, then I'm sure you could get the door to stop at about 135 degrees, or even less if you put it closer to the hinge. Of course the closer that you put it, the more it pushes sideways on the stop.

edit:-Alternatelly, use one of these:-
http://www.safeandsecurity.com/Html/ives/images/442.jpg
http://www.safeandsecurity.com/Html/ives/images/448.jpg

[Tools]

Lockwood make a door stop with a triangular base that is 50mm high.If you are only 1.5inches off the flloor then that would be suitable.There is also another brand that makes a stop that also has proprietary packers for situations such as yours,but I can't think of what it is at the moment.I think the lockwoo d one is called a lockwood 250.You could also make a discrete packer to fit under it to lift it up.

Tools

[Cliff Rogers]

Easy Skew... rip down to the local tyre place & gets a couple of 'used' ones that are gunna get chucked out, wizz over to the job, stand them up behind the door & wang a 3" roofing screw down through the tread from the inside.

Problem solved. :rolleyes:

Tell them it is a work of art & charge them $1300. :D

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Could they each be stopped at the very top with a decorative little jobbie that doubles as a shelf for twig pots etc.?
Something like that might be happening with the back doors, which are glass, as I'm not a great fan of bottom-only stoppers for glass. The owner doesn't want 'em, but I'm fairly confident that the first time his li'l 'uns dash onto the back deck... SLAM! Crack! ...and I'll be getting phone-call. :rolleyes:


Why is it so important that the door doesn't swing back past perpendicular?
'Cos the customer wants it so. :cool:

Do you know of a supplier of those stops? Couldn't find any references to anything but safes on the rest of the site you cited. Also, they need to be gold finish (Same reason as above.) and the bottom of the rubbers at least 2" off the floor..


Lockwood make a door stop with a triangular base that is 50mm high.If you are only 1.5inches off the flloor then that would be suitable.
Yes, I tried the Lockwood 250. It looked good and is a nice stop, but just scraped under. I did make a packer to go under it, but because the fasteners had to be long enough to go through the packer as well, the stop tended to "crab" sideways. Thicker screws would've fixed that, but would've meant drilling out the base of the stop, weakening that instead. I also trialed fastening the packer to the floor first and then seperately fastening the stop to the packer but all the extra holes in the packer made it prone to splitting...

Nothing's ever simple, eh? I don't get paid enough for this! :p

[journeyman Mick]

Skew,
:eek: He lay the bearers on their sides?:eek: What sort of sorry excuse for a tradesman was he? I bitch and moan sometimes about the licensing system we've got in Qld as mostly they're just a revenue raiser, but with people like that around it does raise a strong case for a stricter licensing regime.

If I was fitting an extended stop to the floor I'd be bolting through a large joist offcut, say a 150 x 150 square 50mm thick, or as others have suggested, a large steel compensating plate. I do think though that a commercial doorcloser that can be set to lock open at around 100 degrees might be a more elegant solution (and wouldn't neccesitate crawling around in the dirt :rolleyes: )

In my experience jobs like these can be great or a nightmare, depending on the client. On some jobs they think you're marvellous because you manage to salvage a really messy situation (ie, it's not perfect, but it's miles better than it was). In other cases you're just a bastard tradie because the finished result isn't perfect (ie, you haven't been able to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear;) ) Sounds like you've gotten some good customers there.:cool:

Mick

[pawnhead]

Do you know of a supplier of those stops? Couldn't find any references to anything but safes on the rest of the site you cited. Also, they need to be gold finish (Same reason as above.) and the bottom of the rubbers at least 2" off the floor.. No idea. I just found it googling around.
Here's one that's similar to the one you've made up, but it's got a flange around the base which would give it more stability. http://www.style.net.au/products.hardware?CategoryID=306&Category2ID=335&List=1&catpageindex=3&Level=2&ProductID=20580 You'd still probably have to replace the screw with a bolt and get a big washer for the bottom, or reinforce the floor from underneath before bolting it on.
A couple more that might do the trick:-
http://www.bellevueimports.com.au/showDetailProduct.php?prodID=606&catID=8
http://www.style.net.au/products.hardware?CategoryID=306&Category2ID=335&List=1&catpageindex=1&Level=2&ProductID=20541
I like Cliff Roger's suggestion as well.
Good luck with it.

[Ashore]

Skew just a thought could you fit a stop block close to the door hinges stopping them from opening past 90 deg , perhaps with magnetic face and matching on the door to hold them open


Rgds

[Tools]

Skew just a thought could you fit a stop block close to the door hinges stopping them from opening past 90 deg , perhaps with magnetic face and matching on the door to hold them open


Rgds
There would be too much leverage,and the door would be ripped from its hinges !

Tools

[rowie]

Skew, instead of a doorstop, could you use an extended flush-mount bolt that bolts into the floor. Or if you can't find one with a bolt long enough, a normal length one bolted into a fancy turned disc like you described earlier :)

[mic-d]

Hi Skew,
Have a look here : http://www.australiandoorfurniture.com.au/
under Our Catalogue > Door stops
There seems to be an extra high one there.

Also what about flush bolts with a long throw?
Cheers
Michael

[Old Codger]

you could use a chain on the upper corner of the door or if you also require a hold open device then use a stay similar to what you would use to hold open the lid of a box or chest. If you use the stay it will automatically hold open each time it is fully opened. I would find a specialty suplier of architecural hardware.

[julianx]

I think micks got the best idea, fit good quality door closers, they will look like they belong. Besides people might trip over those chrome phalluses:D

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

I've put a few options to the owner, now it's up to him to make the choice. [shrug]

Thanks for the feedback people, it's always good to have alternatives. :)

[Sigidi]

Any joy yet Skew?

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Yep. Metal plates under the floor was the way to go.

I'm still going to turn some rings to go around the base of the top, but purely for cosmetic reasons... the owner wants 'em there. :)

[seriph1]

totally too late and your customer probably would've vetoed them, but I have long throw door bolts here that go around 50mm and would easily be modified to go up to 70mm - brass and relatively attractive.

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Because the doors are doubles, I'd already fixed flush-mount long throw bolts in the "knobless" door, to hold it shut when it's shut.

But the client wanted stops mainly to prevent the kiddlies from just throwing the doors wide open as they tear through like hurricanes. I had to agree; somehow I don't think they'd bother to take the time to open the door, line it up, throw the bolts... :D

There's a few thing I would've liked to have done differently if 'twas my own place, but... [shrug]