Fuel economy. A challenge.

[Schtoo]

I have been thinking about this for about a week, since the price of regular hit Y140/litre here.

I am now, driving in a manner that I hope will extract the best fuel economy possible from the car I drive.

I also saw an episode of 'Top Gear' where Jeremy Clarkson drove an Audi 800 miles on a tank of fuel, extracting 40MPG (British gallons) from the thing, contrary to what Audi themselves claimed was possible.

So, I had a brainwave.

What say we all give it a shot, just for the sake of saving a few bucks, saving some oil and saving some angst toward the powers that be.

I do think there need to be some simple ground rules, just so it keeps things reasonabable and puts things into perspective.

The amount of fuel is measured at the pump. It need not be same pump every time, but if it's possible please do.

The distance covered is what your car records, whatever error it might have.

Whilst driving, one should not be a menace to other drivers, but taking it easy is quite alright.

Driving at less than, say, 80% of the posted speed limit should be discouraged in good weather conditions and clear roads. Not aiming for gold here, just an improvement.

The type of car, it's engine size, what kind of fuel, etc should be noted as should where and when you drive. Inner city peak hour and Sunday evening on the highway are not equatable, but can at least be compared. Say a rough percentage scale of highway/city/peak/open road. Whatever else you carry in the car should also be noted.

There should be a set 'measure' of fuel economy we all stick to for comparison. I'd say l/100km, but it might be MPG. Whatever is easier for most to get a grip on.

Suggestions are appreciated not only for any 'rules' but also how to improve fuel economy.

Just an idea, and I wonder if anyone is interested it having a shot. :)


This has got my attention right now, since I just found out that we could be driving a new Prius for an additional $2000 per year over 5 years compared to the 9 year old we have now. Based that on the 'driving like a nutjob' economy I was getting, and the RRP of a Prius here.


To open the bidding:

Honda Saber, 2000cc inline 5, automatic FWD.
Approximately 50% busy suburban driving, 10 highway, 40% open roads with lots of hills. A/C on for about 20% of the time right now. Not much junk, just some books, baby seat and other small stuff, say 50kg all up.

Driving like a moron, 7km/l - 14.2l/100km - 16 US MPG.

Clarkson and the Audi, 40 UK MPG - 7l/100km - 33 US MPG.

So, any takers?

[Stu in Tokyo]

I have been thinking about this for about a week, since the price of regular hit Y140/litre here.

I am now, driving in a manner that I hope will extract the best fuel economy possible from the car I drive.

I also saw an episode of 'Top Gear' where Jeremy Clarkson drove an Audi 800 miles on a tank of fuel, extracting 40MPG (British gallons) from the thing, contrary to what Audi themselves claimed was possible.

So, I had a brainwave.

What say we all give it a shot, just for the sake of saving a few bucks, saving some oil and saving some angst toward the powers that be.

I do think there need to be some simple ground rules, just so it keeps things reasonable and puts things into perspective.

The amount of fuel is measured at the pump. It need not be same pump every time, but if it's possible please do.

The distance covered is what your car records, whatever error it might have.

Whilst driving, one should not be a menace to other drivers, but taking it easy is quite alright.

Driving at less than, say, 80% of the posted speed limit should be discouraged in good weather conditions and clear roads. Not aiming for gold here, just an improvement.

The type of car, it's engine size, what kind of fuel, etc should be noted as should where and when you drive. Inner city peak hour and Sunday evening on the highway are not equatable, but can at least be compared. Say a rough percentage scale of highway/city/peak/open road. Whatever else you carry in the car should also be noted.

There should be a set 'measure' of fuel economy we all stick to for comparison. I'd say l/100km, but it might be MPG. Whatever is easier for most to get a grip on.

Suggestions are appreciated not only for any 'rules' but also how to improve fuel economy.

Just an idea, and I wonder if anyone is interested it having a shot. :)


This has got my attention right now, since I just found out that we could be driving a new Prius for an additional $2000 per year over 5 years compared to the 9 year old we have now. Based that on the 'driving like a nutjob' economy I was getting, and the RRP of a Prius here.


To open the bidding:

Honda Saber, 2000cc inline 5, automatic FWD.
Approximately 50% busy suburban driving, 10 highway, 40% open roads with lots of hills. A/C on for about 20% of the time right now. Not much junk, just some books, baby seat and other small stuff, say 50kg all up.

Driving like a moron, 7km/l - 14.2l/100km - 16 US MPG.

Clarkson and the Audi, 40 UK MPG - 7l/100km - 33 US MPG.

So, any takers?

Well, I don't think I'll be able to improve the gas mileage on my delivery vehicle much.......

27822

:D

[Honorary Bloke]

Stu,

I thought that was you. Hanging out here as well as the Creek.:eek: I don't think I'm going to be able to compete with you guys unless I get rid of my Ford F150 V-8. I can burn a tank just idling in the driveway. :(

[Stu in Tokyo]

Stu,

I thought that was you. Hanging out here as well as the Creek.:eek: I don't think I'm going to be able to compete with you guys unless I get rid of my Ford F150 V-8. I can burn a tank just idling in the driveway. :(

Yep it's me, busted....... :rolleyes:

V-8s.....? I remember those, they were some kind of tomato drink or something.......... right...? ;) :D

[Wildman]

I have a 2005 2.0 turbo diesel VW golf 6spd manual. If I take it really easy on the highway, I get around 4.8-5 L/100KM, around town 6.2-6.5 L/100KM, if I drive it fairly hard, around 7.5-8 L/100KM. I averaged 6.1 L/100KM for the first 18,000KM (counting fuel for FBT). Cheaper than a Prius, better re-sale value and nearly as much torque as a commodore (320NM from 1750RPM). I have had some mechanical problems but from all my research, they are not common. It is nice to drive, effortless torque, easy on fuel and it made the missus very happy when I got it (her dream car)

Cheers
Ben

[scooter]

Schtoo, not sure I can drive to get much more economy out of my car, but am interested in the discussion, particularly driving technique that can improve economy.

I drive a Commodore VR wagon, 3.8 V6, auto, on standard ULP. Usually get around 26mpg driving to work, about 70/30 country/town driving.

Usually drive to get best economy, the V6 is very thirsty if you give it a bootful everywhere. Conversely, I read in a report about those vehicles competing in economy challenges that they accellerate hard to get up to the cruising speed to shorten the time spent accelelerating. Or somesuch :confused:

Confused myself I think. :o


Cheers..................Sean

[Grunt]

I get 50 kilometres on a ham and salad roll.

http://www.rockmachine.us/pix/lores/r800.jpg

[graemet]

I am on my second Peugeot 2l turbo diesel, this one is a 406, over 10,000km i averaged 6.3 l/100km which was one return trip to Narromine and the rest Sydney peak hour going to and from work. Just driving from Sydney to Dubbo gives about 4.9l/100 km over the mountains. They tell me I can do better if I don't drive like a leadfoot!
My earlier car was a 405 2 litre turbo, one was driven from Melbourne to Rockhampton on a tank of fuel!
Cheers
Graeme

[journeyman Mick]

Grunt,
That's excellent, especially on a bike without pedals.:p

Mick (the picky bugger)

[Iain]

Grunt,
That's excellent, especially on a bike without pedals.:p

Mick (the picky bugger)
Baked Beans, who needs pedals:p

[reybec]

i drive a 2004 V6 Holden Rodeo

i think the best i can do is around 15 - 16 l/100km:mad:

[ian]

Driving at less than, say, 80% of the posted speed limit should be discouraged in good weather conditions and clear roads. Not aiming for gold here, just an improvement.

The type of car, it's engine size, what kind of fuel, etc should be noted as should where and when you drive. Inner city peak hour and Sunday evening on the highway are not equatable, but can at least be compared. Say a rough percentage scale of highway/city/peak/open road. Whatever else you carry in the car should also be noted.

There should be a set 'measure' of fuel economy we all stick to for comparison. I'd say l/100km, but it might be MPG. Whatever is easier for most to get a grip on.

Suggestions are appreciated not only for any 'rules' but also how to improve fuel economy.

Just an idea, and I wonder if anyone is interested it having a shot. :)

This has got my attention right now, since I just found out that we could be driving a new Prius for an additional $2000 per year over 5 years compared to the 9 year old we have now. Based that on the 'driving like a nutjob' economy I was getting, and the RRP of a Prius here.

To open the bidding:

Honda Saber, 2000cc inline 5, automatic FWD.
Approximately 50% busy suburban driving, 10 highway, 40% open roads with lots of hills. A/C on for about 20% of the time right now. Not much junk, just some books, baby seat and other small stuff, say 50kg all up.

Driving like a moron, 7km/l - 14.2l/100km - 16 US MPG.

Clarkson and the Audi, 40 UK MPG - 7l/100km - 33 US MPG.

So, any takers?OK
1998 Audi A4 2.4l V6 95 or 98 Octane
mix of freeway (at 110 to 120 km/h Sydney to Bowral and back), urban longer distance (10 to 40 km), urban very short distance (to school and back about 4km, engine stays cold) regularly get about 9.8l/ 100km

[fxst]

1980 Patrol 4WD 3.3l non turbo diesel and get about 300+km on 20l of diesel.
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BUT the rest of the 60 litre tank is filled with old vegi oil :D :D
I know go away and repent
sorry
Pete

[journeyman Mick]

99 Rodeo, 2.8 turbo diesel, trayback 4wd with steel canopy. I get between 10.5L/100km to 11L/100km. mix of about 10% short trips - 10kms or so and the rest either:
60Kms to Cairns and back (down and then up a steep winding mountain range) with maybe 20kms of town driving still averaging about 40 - 50 kmh but a bit stop and start, lots of diferent places to go, and/or:

drive to Mareeba or further, 60kms + round trip, open country road.

I tend to get worse mileage on the country run, probably because its wide open roads with little traffic and I tend to sit on 120kmh for a lot of it. Load varies from nothing but toolbox - maybe 100kg or so, to a tray full of kitchen cabinets and a heavy trailer with more cabinets behind. The mileage doesn't vary that much with a diesel whether it's full laden or empty and it doesn't really affect the temperature gauge either. I've tried driving very carefully and it doesn't seem to make any difference. If I really hammer it (running late, or high speeds on the open road with a full load) then it slips to maybe 11.5 L/100km but in general about 11L/100km is what it sits on. I've got a intercooler which I've yet to fit and it will be interesting to see what difference it makes. I may also fit one (or more) "Hiclones" after I've fitted the intercooler.

I'll also post some pics (later when I've actually taken them) of my fuel saver which cuts consumption down to a few thimblefuls ;) .

Mick

[Schtoo]

You need more than a ham and salad roll to pedal 50km.

I do have a bike, I should ride more often except that I have an aversion to being at work stinking and dripping sweat since I can't really change and I can't take a shower.

That, and ice is slippery stuff.

So summer is shot, winter is shot so I drive more often now.

Now, here's the thing Grunt, how long do your chains last and which chains do you use?

[Stu in Tokyo]

1997 Honda VTR1000F

http://www.ablett.jp/bikes/images/oct_9th_10_2005/vtr_rest_area2.jpg
Drive like a nutter on a nice twisty mountain road, I'm lucky to see 11 Km/litre, on the expressway, at about 110 km/h, top gear, plodding along, I get 22 km/liter :D

Cheers!

[Grunt]

You need more than a ham and salad roll to pedal 50km.


I ride 50ks after a fairly big bowl of hi-fibre cereal. Depending on the weather, 2-4 litres of weak cordial and a hand full or two of fruit and nut mix. Maybe a little more that a ham and salad roll.



I do have a bike, I should ride more often except that I have an aversion to being at work stinking and dripping sweat since I can't really change and I can't take a shower.


That's a bugger. Having a shower at work is manditory for me.



That, and ice is slippery stuff.
So summer is shot, winter is shot so I drive more often now.



Also, a bugger. I don't ride when it's icy.



Now, here's the thing Grunt, how long do your chains last and which chains do you use?

I don't actually know. More than 3000ks. I've got Shimano Tiagra crankset, cassette and chain. I service the bike fairly often tho.

I didn't spend a whole lot on the bike when I got it last year. I'm thinking that I need to upgrade as I'm starting to take this bike stuff seriously.

[Daddles]

My old lump (AUll Falcon wagon) runs on LPG and, while there is a noticeable drop in power where you go from petrol to gas, there is only a minor change in fuel economy (hard to pick in city traffic). While this is nice in some ways, it does make one ask questions about the efficiency of the drive train :rolleyes:

My father recently sold his '95 Falcon and bought a brand new Fiesta - they'd decided to give up the grey nomad lifestyle and sell the caravan. He's always kept very good records for his cars ... something wrong with him methinks, he's not like his son at all. They made the decision to sell. Chose the new car, and yes, fuel economy was part of the decision (and price, couldn't afford what they really wanted). On the weekend before they sold the Falcon, they had to take a trip up to Renmark and back. By now, Dad had taken out the ton and half of stuff he used to carry in the boot. He didn't work out the figures until a week later, after they'd bought the Fiesta - the old Falcon returned near enough to 40 mpg for the trip :eek: Make him wonder about the new buzz box for a moment, until he allowed himself to remember that this figure was ... um, unusual, though 35 on a long trip without the van wasn't.

Richard

[Schtoo]

Darn you to heck Grunt, I was hoping you didn't know squat so I could jump all over you. ;)

I used to get about 4-5,000km per chain, only SRAM ones though. You can take them off the bike and clean them properly, which makes a big difference. The original Shimano chain was worn out by 1,000km or so.

I changed the gears, rear derailleur, rear shifter and chain after 4 chains, even though the gears have some life left. The derailleur was completely worn out though, would not shift cleanly no matter what I did. Not a bad effort considering I don't go too slow and have enough legs to give it all a hard time.

If yer wondering, the higher grade stuff is worth it, if only for the extra smoothness gained, weight isn't important to me since I am not a lightweight and niether is the bike. I think the better stuff may last a little longer too, but I have no evidence to back that up.

Daddles, the thing we have gets great economy on a long trip, all things considered. Not quite 40mpg, but I don't sit on 100km/h here either and the car isn't really happy (revs wise) over 110 anyways.


Please keep it up. I still don't need fuel for the car yet, since this week has been quiet and I seem to be getting a lot more out of it, but maybe not.

And diesel might be a very viable option too. Not sure if Mrs. Schtoo will be happy with that though...

[Auld Bassoon]

2004 Audi A4 2.4 Multitronic (the CVT one). Melbourne city commute, average around 11.6l/100Km. A longer drive (say to Canberra), the consumption drops to about 7.4l/100Km.

[Wood Butcher]

This is now my daily commuter
http://woodworkforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=26651&d=1153083307
Approx 2.4l/100kms. We also have a AU I Falcon which we average 8.5l/100kms

[Andy Mac]

Hi Schtoo,
I have already posted about fuel economy in my Ford Courier (10.5l/100km), and I don't think it'll get much better really. My drive to work involves too many red lights (I should count them) so many runs through the gears and I tend to have a heavy foot.:o The annoying thing with the gearing in said ute is it doesn't like being put in 4th below 60kph, so if someone ahead is doing 55 I tend to drive along in 3rd!! Not good for economy.
I once fitted a quality vacuum gauge to a Kombi I had (twin Webers, extractors, the works!) and ocassionally drove according to the reading...a very soft foot to keep it below a certain level. Maybe I should try the same.
I am contemplating a couple of things, like trading the ute for something renowned for fuel economy...which usually cost more to buy initially, and prolly means no tray for wood'n'metal:eek:; giving up work in town and finding something closer (yeah right, in the bush!); or selling up and moving back to the 'burbs.

Cheers,

[ozwinner]

This is now my daily commuter
http://woodworkforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=26651&d=1153083307
Approx 2.4l/100kms. We also have a AU I Falcon which we average 8.5l/100kms

Im sure you look pretty sweet on that in your red lycra gear. :eek:

Al :p :D

[mic-d]

On the highway in my 2wd 2.7l Hilux, aircon on, averaging probably about 90kmh, I get 10.5l/100km. Our Turbo deisel Prado gets 10l/100km at 110km/h aircon on and damn near gets from Melbourne to Brisbane in one day on one tank! In a couple of years I'll convince SwMBO to fill up on my biodeisel
Cheers
Michael

[Auld Bassoon]

Yonks ago when back in the UK I had a Jaguar XJ-S with a 5.3L V12. At best I got around 16MPG, but when 'playing' this would drop to under 9MPG... Tut, tut... :D

[weisyboy]

i have a holden rodeo deisel 2000 model and i get 13km/L

[Wood Butcher]

Im sure you look pretty sweet on that in your red lycra gear. :eek:

Al :p :D

Least I'd look better than you in your "foil" http://www.ubeaut.biz/thefinger.gif

[Daddles]

Yonks ago when back in the UK I had a Jaguar XJ-S with a 5.3L V12. At best I got around 16MPG, but when 'playing' this would drop to under 9MPG... Tut, tut... :D

Question mate, where'd you find a cliff high enough to give you 16mpg:confused:

Richard

[I_wanna_Shed]

5.7L V8 Holden Commodore SS.

I always work out my usage when I fill up, just out of interest to see what little tricks work and what doesn't.

City driving sees about 15L/100km if you take it easy. When its on the highway in 6th gear it sits on around 8-9L/100km.

My weekly trips are about 60/40 Highway/City, and it averages around 12L/100km.

[Auld Bassoon]

Question mate, where'd you find a cliff high enough to give you 16mpg:confused:

Richard

:D :D By tailgating trucks on the motorway :eek: :eek: :eek: :D :D :D

Seriously, that thing was a mongrel for fuel, and just about the most unreliable new car I've ever had. I kept it for 7 months, then dumped it for a Porsche 911 :D (Oh bring back the happy consumerist '80s:rolleyes: )

[ozwinner]

Well after reading all your posts I dont feel too bad about my F250 getting only 20l/100kms after all.
I am usually loaded up with tools/scaffold/1/2 tonne of cement and one, sometimes two excited brickies.

Al :p

[Auld Bassoon]

and one sometimes 2 excited brickies.

Al :p

Or just plain nervous (especially the goats :eek: ) :D :D :D

[Grunt]

F250 getting only 20l/100kms after all.

How many ham and salad rolls is that?

[ozwinner]

How many ham and salad rolls is that?

The salad dont count, ya know that.

Al :p

[Schtoo]

A slight improvement.

From 14.2l/100km to 12l/100km, and running the A/C nearly all the time.

I guess a light foot and not driving like a nimrod does help don't it? :D

(Still a fuel guzzler in my book though. :( )

[Metal Head]

Govt urged to consider alternative fuels

The federal government is under growing pressure from within its own ranks to consider alternative fuels as a way to help ease the pressure of spiralling petrol prices. But Prime Minister John Howard has won endorsement from the joint party room for his refusal to cut excise on petrol. Fresh from six weeks in their electorates during the winter recess, coalition MPs and senators let Mr Howard know that the high price of petrol is the most pressing issue for voters.

They used a special joint party room meeting to raise their concerns about high fuel prices, with Mr Howard conceding the issue was hurting. Both the coalition and Labor have ruled out any cut in fuel excise, which now funnels 38 cents per litre into government coffers. A 10 cent cut in the excise would cost around $3 billion. Petrol was the most frequent topic raised by the 47 government members who spoke during the three-hour meeting. Coalition members generally were supportive of the government's refusal to cut excise, party room sources said. However, they wanted the government to look at what it could do "around the edges" to help families cope with high petrol costs.

Rebel Nationals senator Barnaby Joyce wants the fuel tax cut but concedes it will do little to solve the problem in the longer term. He is suggesting the government consider investing more in alternative fuel sources. "A cut in excise is an issue that should be on the table, but that's not going to find an alternate product," he said. "That's just going to encourage people to continue using the same product." He repeated calls for the government to mandate ethanol content in petrol, further develop alternative fuel sources and strengthen the Trade Practices Act to boost fuel price monitoring.

Liberal backbencher David Jull also backs the idea of alternative fuels. "I think ultimately you've got to look at alternative fuels," he said. Some service stations now sell petrol blended with ethanol but Mr Howard has maintained his opposition to mandating levels of ethanol or any other bio-fuel. Ethanol is extracted from sugar cane but Mr Jull said there were other options which would help increase the amount of ethanol used in the Australian market. "Ultimately, you've got to go the full hog, you've got to look at every possible conceivable alternative to fossil fuels," Mr Jull said.

Labor believes giving the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission (ACCC) more power to prevent gouging by oil companies is crucial to addressing the issue. Labor competition spokesman Joel Fitzgibbon flagged moves by the opposition this week to give the ACCC more to formally monitor and investigate petrol prices. "In 1997, (Treasurer) Peter Costello took away (ACCC chairman) Graeme Samuel's powers to formally monitor and investigate petrol prices," Mr Fitzgibbon said. "This week in the parliament I'll be moving amendments to allow Graeme Samuel to do so and of course I'll be challenging government backbenchers to support my amendment."

[sawdustmike]

Took the wifes new Hyundai elantra - the one with all the stuff auto etc- down to the bush and back today. On the way there sitting on 120 it got 7.1l/100k and that was with a howling tail wind (gusts to 80kmh). On the way home with a boot full of jarrah (don't laugh it was about 100kgs worth) sailing into said gale I sat on 110 and got 6.8l/100k. Work that one out. Before you ask, no she didn't know about the Jarrah in the boot, for that matter she didn't know about me taking the car either. Teach her to go to the swim through called diggers and dealers. Hah.