Something is bothering me all morning

[Wongo]

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,19603976-1245,00.html

Raped, killed and she was only 8.:(

If there is death penalty let me be the first one to put my hand up on this one.

[silentC]

I just don't understand why these things happen. I suppose when you have kids of your own it reaches a bit deeper than it would otherwise. I read it yesterday and all I could think of was how terrible it would have been for that little girl wondering why this was happening. And then the parents, and the uncle, will always blame themselves. And then I think of something like that happening to my little girl. I would gladly go to gaol for life for killing the guy with my bare hands.

[martrix]

No words can describe the abhorrence of this crime....




Disgusting thing about this, is that this offender was arrested and charged in 2003 for sexually assaulting another 8 year and went to court.......but was released on a technicalityhttp://www.ubeaut.biz/pi_mad.gif....there is little, to no justice left in the Law anymore, stripped to the bone's by scum lawyers.......Had he been convicted and put away then, that innocent young girl would be alive today...


Never, ever take your eyes off your's or other peoples Kids in public, some humans cannot be trusted.....rant off!

[macca2]

Wongo, I don't know about over your way but here in the west we are constantly hearing, after the trial, that the offender had done this sort of thing before, but got off on lack of evidence, or a technicality or was released on bail and reoffended.
The cops do all the hard work and then the do gooders in the justice system let them off lightly because they had a bad childhood or some other bulldust story.
The sooner a political party takes on the sentencing of offenders seriously
the sooner lives will be saved.
Come on pollies GET WITH THE REAL WORLD.

Macca

[Glenn_M]

I would gladly go to gaol for life for killing the guy with my bare hands.

8 months ago I would have had trouble understanding a comment like this.
7 months ago my daughter was born. Silent, now I understand.

I agree with Martrix - some humans can't be trusted. Problem is it's hard to tell those that cant from those that can.:( Never let them leave your sight - nothing could ever be worth the risk of something like this happening to you.

[doug the slug]

I would gladly go to gaol for life for killing the guy with my bare hands.

I know what you mean, silentC. If anyone did something similar to a member of my family or close friends he had better hope that the cops get him before i do :mad: Cos if i got him first there would be no chance of him re-offending

[Wongo]

Sometimes you just think the laws are there to protect bad people.:mad:


I know what I will do now, if the girls need to use the bathroom. I will send them to the one for the disabled. Make sure it is safe to go in and wait outside the door.

[Greg Q]

Sometimes you just think the laws are there to protect bad people.:mad:


I know what I will do now, if the girls need to use the bathroom. I will send them to the one for the disabled. Make sure it is safe to go in and wait outside the door.

I just had the same discussion with my wife an hour ago. My family shops at that mall when visiting my sister-in-law in Canning Vale. It does make your blood run cold.

I spend a lot of my parenting time on bogey man patrol. I want a swat team back-up sometimes. Having a family suddenly reveals the merits of tougher laws, real sentencing, Humvees, moats. Big M/F'ing guns.

The perps in these cases are damaged, unfixable. We should treat them the way other species treat defective specimens.

Greg

[Zed]

i cant possibly disagree with any of the above. the words screaming torture come too mind. however the "honourable" crooks in the pen will fix hius little red wagon for him... they only need a few minutes...... after all some of them are parents too...

[black1]

i cant possibly disagree with any of the above. the words screaming torture come too mind. however the "honourable" crooks in the pen will fix hius little red wagon for him... they only need a few minutes...... after all some of them are parents too...

no they wont they will put him into the protected wing where all the other nutters are:mad:

"I know what I will do now, if the girls need to use the bathroom. I will send them to the one for the disabled. Make sure it is safe to go in and wait outside the door." quote from wongo

not just my girls but the boys also

very sad that this has happened especially when ya here it a 630 am on the radio (http://www.ubeaut.biz/ahgee.gif)
(http://www.ubeaut.biz/ahgee.gif)
reckon his nurrys should be torn off of him http://www.ubeaut.biz/bash.gif

[bennylaird]

A death sentence for this freak is to good for him, may he live a long life in general confinement in gaol.

[womble]

as others have already said he will be placed in a protected wing in prison, I work part time at our local prison here and they do that as well. One of the worst things about being a prison officer is looking after such beings, despite your personal beliefs about their crimes you still have to do your job by the book :(

[Auld Bassoon]

I heard this on the car radio going to work. Although not a parent, the though of what happened to that little girl wouldn't go away. Awful, just too awful.

Methinks that the perp. will have some "entertainment' to look forward to in prison. Better a lifetime of that than execution...

[ozwinner]

I get so annoyed hearing this type of stuff over and over again.
If anyone hurt my lot they would have to hope that the cops got to them first.

Al :mad:

[Two-Words]

If it was one of my kids and he ever got out (just because they don't have to balls to hang him - which they should, slowly), I'd be waiting for him and just shoot the P****. They could take me to court but there wouldn't be a jury anywhere that would find you guilty. I wouldn't care anyway.

Sorry, every now and again, you need more than just 2 words. :mad:

[ozwinner]

Bang-bang

Al :p

[dazzler]

Hey

Just horrific. I'll take a stab at this and bet this was will turn out to be a mental health issue and he did it to get put away cause he couldnt get sectioned.:(

Watch this space.

Sad day


dazzler

[johnc]

With daughters of my own I agree fully with what has gone before. However like Dazzler I do wonder if this is another nut who did not get the required care, we seem to have a growing mental health problem which we are only just beginning to realise needs to be treated very differently especially with sex offenders and other high risk individuals.

Quite frankly just lock him up forever, no matter what the excuse, to take the life of a lovely little girl like that removes any right to re enter society ever. No matter how depraved he had to know he was doing wrong.

John

[Chesand]

Individuals like that are a great waste of space on this earth.
I hope that he gets his just deserts while in the pen - he might just end up in the wrong section for a few minutes due to an 'honest' mistake by warders..

[outback]

I'm against the death penalty. I wavered for a long time, and sat on the fence, eventually deciding that unless I could, without fear of conscience actually take another persons life, I would be a hypocrit to support it.

Yesterday I learnt of this crime.


Today I have lost faith in the human race, and, built a ladder to climb to the other side of the fence.

The perpetrator of this act does not deserve the privilege of living on this Earth.

[ozwinner]

I'm against the death penalty. I wavered for a long time, and sat on the fence, eventually deciding that unless I could, without fear of conscience actually take another persons life, I would be a hypocrit to support it.

Yesterday I learnt of this crime.


Today I have lost faith in the human race, and, built a ladder to climb to the other side of the fence.

The perpetrator of this act does not deserve the privilege of living on this Earth.

There are crimes that are just so wrong that make the most staid of us change course, this is one of those crimes.

Al :(

[E. maculata]

A little boy was terribly molested at a small shopping village just north of here last month, while his Mum waited right outside, it's too late for the kid once it's happened, at work discussed this with several other Dads, including single ones with daughters, they like me take absolutely no chances with any of them,including going into the ladies to check at times, although parent/baby change facilites are good as well as disabled as you go in with them. And I don't even want to think too deeply about what that poor little child had to endure before the uckin animal put out her liitle flame, cause if I do all my humanity and civilsed behaviour will disappear.......

[sbranden]

This is a heartbreaking story. I have 5 children from 3 to 20 and would be devistated if any of them suffered just 5% of what this little girl did. It must be hard knowing now what was happening just the other side of that locked door.

peace and safety for everyone here and their family

shaun

[Harry II]

Give me one reason why he should live after what he did? Can't we decide where to draw the line anymore? We will be paying for his "right to life" for the rest of his life, for what? Where's the justice, what does justice mean? I'm sorry, so sad, for the little girl, please be a heaven for her.

[Greg Q]

With daughters of my own I agree fully with what has gone before. However like Dazzler I do wonder if this is another nut who did not get the required care, we seem to have a growing mental health problem which we are only just beginning to realise needs to be treated very differently especially with sex offenders and other high risk individuals.

Quite frankly just lock him up forever, no matter what the excuse, to take the life of a lovely little girl like that removes any right to re enter society ever. No matter how depraved he had to know he was doing wrong.

John

well, he ran from the scene, sweating, so I'd say he had the presence of a guilty mind, no matter how damaged. I still maintain he's unfixable, and makes a mockery of the sanctity of human life. How many people here now? 6 1/2 Billion? Tell me again how this prick's existence is nescessary.

For some reason this one makes me feel the way I felt when I heard of Port Arthur.

[Ashore]

I think the perpetrator is a little unballanced , needs an ounce of lead behind the left ear, and I for one would be happy to assist in his balancing.
My deepest sympathy to the poor girls family and I hope that in time they come to be at peace, though I feel this may take a very long time if it ever happens, some help would possibly be if the animal that did this horrific act was also gone.
Regardless of your views on capital punishment , can anyone tell me why I should have to pay to feed and clothe this thing, and why it should not be just removed from this earth so that there is never a future threat as well.
Call it a knee jerk reaction , give all the excuses, but that crime was pure evil and needs to be dealt with accordingly.

[savage]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I am sure I heard on the news today that this bloke was one of two boys several years back that took a young boy from a shopping mall in the U.K.. His body was found on nearby railway tracks bludgeoned to death and sexually assulted, the victims name was Bolger or something like that.

When released he was sent to OZ for his own protection, as it was declared unsafe for him to be released in the british society for fear he would be killed. So they gave him a new identity and sent him here, now he has done it again. Are we still a convict state?....:mad:

I will correct myself, the news has just come on and he has no connection with the British crime.

[womble]

who knows why he did it, but whatever the reason he is clearly unstable. I hope he doesn't end up like the mental cases here in QLD, a bloke who murdered a teenage girl just a few short years ago is out already as his schizophrenia got him a 'get out of jail free' ticket, he went to mental health unit instead. Served no time in jail at all.

He needs to rot away in jail, where he will almost certainly contract hep c or maybe even aids, even in protection. Sexual deviants can't help themselves when it comes to satisfying their urges. Once that happens a slow, painful death will occur. Something he deserves.

[Schtoo]

I must be a little different to all you folks.

I would let the police catch the scum, and make sure they got the right mutt.


I wouldn't wish anyone innocent to recieve what I would deal out, and I would most certainly take my time. Weeks if possible.


There are a couple like this over here right now. One where some wacko did the same to an 8 year old girl, and with any luck he will grow by another few inches above his shoulders.

Another where some crackpot killed then set fire to a woman and her son/daughter. Admitted to doing it, and got the rope. Showed absolutely no remorse, and laughed at the guy whose family he killed.

Now his &^$^%$ of a lawyer managed to get the rope repealed, and seems to looking at getting this worthless piece of slime out on parole.


(I do think the Chinese do have a thing with billing the family for the bullet though. ;) )

[bennylaird]

I was reported last night on radio, may be right or wrong, his previous attack on another 8 year old was thrown out of court because his confession was obtained after a long interview in which some heavy handedness may have occurrred. The interogators were the ones who where punished.

Where is the legal system going wrong?

[Wongo]

I know how these things work. Find a psychiatrist and prove that he is mentally ill and he can walk free.:mad:

The other thing is no matter what, he can always find a lawyer who is willing to defend him.:mad:

[workgoose]

Bring back the death penalty - it would save a lot of hard-earned taxpayer's money keeping scum like that in the pen...

[bennylaird]

Only trouble is there must be a 100% certainty of guilt, and how can it be done without making someone else a killer, ie. the executioner?

Otherwises hang the -arstard................

[Two-Words]

I know how these things work. Find a psychiatrist and prove that he is mentally ill and he can walk free.:mad:



That shouldn't be necessary. Perpetrating a crime like that is proof that you are mentally nuts anyway. A sane person couldn't do it. Same as Bryant, Knight etc. Freakin' nut bags the lot of them.

Therefore, mental illness is no excuse. I see they executed another one in the US yesterday and good on 'em. We should have degrees of murder here like they do over there. 1st degree murder is premeditated, cold blooded etc. That gets the big noose. Then you have 2nd and 3rd degree for people like the guy who killed David Hookes. Not the death penalty but severe in any case.

All we have here is murder and then manslaughter. They plea bargian murder cases down to manslaughter and get lighter sentences. It stinks.

Stuff rehabilitation, just shoot the pricks.:mad:

[workgoose]

Yes of course there would have to be absolute proof that the person is guilty, otherwise you are just committing another murder.

[jmk89]

As a father of two small children, I also abhore the crime and worry about the safety of my kids.

But as a lawyer and having investigated the situation closely over 25 years, I have to say a few things:
1. when we had the death penalty, juries wouldn't convict - put yourself in their place, after you have heard all the evidence and the defence has thrown all kinds of theories that explain the crime, are you prepared to say that you are so convinced that the person is guilty that you will say that they must hang?
2. Remember the errors that have been made, people wrongly convicted based on cooked up evidence, bad forensic science or prejudice or even where there has been an honest mistake - you can release the mistakenly convicted from gaol, but you can't bring them back to life. It pays to put yourself in the position of an innocent, but wrongly prosecuted defendant the system is biased in favour of the defendant because any of us can find ourselves in that position and it is better for some guilty people to go free than for any innocent person to be convicted.
3. There is no evidence that the death penalty leads to less serious crime being committed - the best test case is New Zealand where over a lengthy period the death penalty was applied for murder and then not applied then reapplied. Some years had more murders than others, but over the long run the murder rate remained about the same regardless of the penalty.
4. Rarely is a plea of insanity successful - the legal test of insanity means that not just any mental derangement will get you off entirely, it has to be so serious that the person did not know the wrongful character of what they were doing. And if it is successful, the usual consequence is that the person is detained in an istitution for the insane - no parole and good behaviour here - it is an indefinite sentence.
5. All the statistics show that the actual rate of these crimes (not only on a per capita basis but also in absolute numbers) has fallen consistently since 1900. So why does it seem that there are more of them? Because we now have these crimes from all over the world presented daily through the media. You are actually safer today than ever before from random violence, thanks to all the undervalued elements of our justice system - police, forensic and crime scene investigators, prisons, psychiatrists etc (and even lawyers).
6. One reason that it seems that there are more "failures" in the system is the fact that the failures get reported in the press - the vast majority of even very serious crimes lead to a guilty plea because the evidence is so strong (especially now that there is DNA fingerprinting) and the "tariff" for the crime is well known (with due allowance for a guilty plea). What you hear about is the few (relatively) instances when things don't happen according to the book - someone pleads "not guilty" or the prison system releases someone too soon and they re-offend.

I dislike these crimes as much as the next person. They sicken me to the stomache. But the basic structure of our justice system is sound and we should not over-react or think that our society has got sicker than our parents' and grandparents'. I suppose in the end, my view is that my attitude to the justice system in Australia is like Winston Churchill's view on democracy; "the worst of all possible systems, except for all the others".

[silentC]

I think the arguments against the death penalty are as valid as they ever were. It's natural for us as thinking emotional beings to have this first reaction when we hear of something like this. For some reason, we extend the protectiveness that we feel for our own kids to other children that we have never met. It always seems worse when children are involved, even though it is probably no more tragic than when something similar happens to an adult. It's natural that we howl for blood.

I suppose the thing is that we are now an 'enlightened' society and we rule with our heads and not our hearts. No matter how offensive the crime, the perpetrator is always entitled to a defence and to the same rights the rest of us have. That's the system we have, and as has been said, it's better for ten guilty people to walk free than for an innocent person to be imprisoned.

Yet our hearts are the vestiges of our animal ancestry and no matter how much talking our heads do, in the heat of the moment, we will always react on instinct.

String him up!

[Grunt]

I try not to pay too much attention to stories like this. They just depress me.

However, my wife got home from night shift this morning and said she was reading about this story last night and the name of the perp 'Dante Arthurs' rung a bell. She did a bit more research and discovered that he is the son of a guy I worked with back it Perth. I met him as a kid maybe 14 years ago, actually he was at my house for a party we held once.

It makes this disturbing story more so for me. I feel for the bloke I worked with. It must be devistating to discover you child is a monster and capable of such a terrible act.

[Two-Words]

are you prepared to say that you are so convinced that the person is guilty that you will say that they must hang?

Most definitely - yes.


2. Remember the errors that have been made, people wrongly convicted based on cooked up evidence, bad forensic science or prejudice or even where there has been an honest mistake - you can release the mistakenly convicted from gaol, but you can't bring them back to life. It pays to put yourself in the position of an innocent, but wrongly prosecuted defendant the system is biased in favour of the defendant because any of us can find ourselves in that position and it is better for some guilty people to go free than for any innocent person to be convicted.

We are talking about absolute certainty here. Bryant, Knight etc. There are many cases where there is absolutely no doubt.


3. There is no evidence that the death penalty leads to less serious crime being committed .

I couldn't care less. It certainly won't increase the crime rate. They do the crime, they get the punishment and they won't be around to offend again.

Don't tell me harsh punishment doesn't act as a deterant.

Do they litter in Singapore? No. And why not?

No matter what the polies, lawyers and bleeding hearts say, if there was a referendum on it, capital punishment would be back and with a massive majority in favour. Then again, we're just the majority of the population and we need to be told whats good for us by others. :mad:

[Grunt]

Many of people in the U.S. have been wrongly convicted and executed over the last few decades (25 in the last six years). DNA evidence has exonerated them. Sadly it was discovered it too late.

The justice system is flawed. It makes mistakes.

[silentC]

I couldn't care less. It certainly won't increase the crime rate. They do the crime, they get the punishment and they won't be around to offend again.
This is a good point. Are we punishing first and preventing second? Or the other way around? Is the purpose of sending a person to prison to provide a warning to others? Or is it to punish the person who commited the crime and prevent them from doing it again for the term of their incarceration? Which of the two is more important?

Threatening people with fines or imprisonment doesn't stop people from committing offences. Maybe the threat of corporal or capital punishment would. Maybe not, but it would give the victims some satisfaction. Hand me that cat o' nine tails.

[Iain]

I think the perpetrator is a little unballanced , needs an ounce of lead behind the left ear, and I for one would be happy to assist in his balancing.
My deepest sympathy to the poor girls family and I hope that in time they come to be at peace, though I feel this may take a very long time if it ever happens, some help would possibly be if the animal that did this horrific act was also gone.
Regardless of your views on capital punishment , can anyone tell me why I should have to pay to feed and clothe this thing, and why it should not be just removed from this earth so that there is never a future threat as well.
Call it a knee jerk reaction , give all the excuses, but that crime was pure evil and needs to be dealt with accordingly.
Whilst I agree with most of your content, the first paragraph is flawed, right should be included for sake of correct and certain balance.
I am not taking this lightly just have nothing to add that hasn't already been said, and having my own little demons gnawing at me after a fatal accident (young boy about 10) I may have been able to help avoid if I hadn't left my mobile phone at home.

[bennylaird]

Would love to see the statistics of repeat offenders?

[Iain]

Having spent 20 years in a correctional (?) environment, I can assure you that most customers are regulars.

[Two-Words]

Many of people in the U.S. have been wrongly convicted and executed over the last few decades (25 in the last six years). DNA evidence has exonerated them. Sadly it was discovered it too late.

The justice system is flawed. It makes mistakes.

So based on that, you'd let them off the hook ? So that in 20 years some do-gooder parole board is convinced they are 'rehabilitated' and out they come. Take Mr Baldy for example, he shouldn't be out but he is. You keep missing the point, some are absolutely guilty with out any shadow of doubt. Are you saying that Bryant shouldn't be dangling on the end of some twine, just because a few mistakes may or may not have been made?

[Grunt]

I'm saying don't execute them. Keep them in goal for the rest of their lives. No parole.
The people in the U.S. who were wrongly executed were guilty without a shadow of a doubt.

[Iain]

do-gooder parole board is convinced they are 'rehabilitated' and out they come.
It is apparent you have no concept of who makes up a parole board and the Act that governs the operation of the same.
Have a look at how they work before passing judgement, not that I condone every decision they have made.

[Two-Words]

It is apparent you have no concept of who makes up a parole board and the Act that governs the operation of the same.
Have a look at how they work before passing judgement, not that I condone every decision they have made.

Iain, you are correct, I have no knowledge of who makes up the parole board. Nor do I care. I can only judge them on the farcical number of times we read about offenders being let off early, sent home to complete their sentences etc etc.

Their record is appauling. If only they could be made accountable and liable for crimes committed by people who are out on parole, maybe they'd act differently.

Just like the legal profession who believe that suspended sentences are actually a sentence, when in fact we all know that it's crap. The crims are laughing at us all the way home. Public pressure on idiots like Hulls has brought that scenario to an end and i think the same will happen with all this leniency - eventually.

[Iain]

A suspended sentence does serve to put pressure on the recipient in as much as if they should offend during the period of the suspended sentence they get a new sentence plus the time of the suspended sentence to serve as well, the same applies to good behaviour bonds and warnings.
They were introduced to take the pressure of prison overcrowding which has become a major problem over the past couple of decades.
As the population of Australia continues to grow, so does the prison population and villains in general, in percentage terms, probably little has changed.
Of course the suspended sentence can be negated by the Magistrate/Judge running the terms concurrently, which they can do with any multiple charges.
The Courts administer law, politicians make law (with a few exceptions).
Capitol punishment was abolished in 1974 I think, however, Corporal punishment is still on the statutes (in Vic anyway).

[Two-Words]

A suspended sentence does serve to put pressure on the recipient in as much as if they should offend during the period of the suspended sentence they get a new sentence plus the time of the suspended sentence to serve as well, the same applies to good behaviour bonds and warnings. .
Which means that if they don't misbehave during that time, they have actually avoided any sort of punishment at all. Hardly what I'd call fair or reasonable.

[ernknot]

The justice system is just a pi22ing contest between the prosecutor and the defence lawyer. They dont give a toss about the victim or the offender. In the end both get paid. As for our judges ........ something not right there as well......
Why have a parole board? If you get x years, then serve the sentence.
Now you get rewarded for good behaviour after you ruin someones life?
Why do you think we have repeat offenders? Because it is better inside than outside, no tax, free medical and dental, free access to legal documents/ assistance, why you can even send mail to your victim!! Access to gyms a good diet free TV, free internet, etc. etc. Do you think these morons could make it outside? NO WAY.
As for child killers, molesters etc. they should be put down and not "suffer" at taxpayers expense for the rest of their life as per above.

[Zed]

this thread is serving no valid purpose, closed.