jobs in the industry

[Garell]

Hi to all

Forgive me if I am barking up the wrong tree or posting in the wrong part of the forum. I have been giving some carefull consideration to where my furture might take me in the job aspects. I work as a tree surgeon on a private property. Not so bad. But I have a bit of a passion for building thing's. So with only self taught knowlage, would it be unresonable to take a portfolio of the woodworkng projects I have done over the years, take them to a furnature manufacturer (custom design stuff) and see if i can get a job doing it. The only problem is I am afraid that (if i fluked it and got a job) that I might lose interest in doing my own projects here at home. Also bit worried that I can't realy go down in pay neither, bit hard with 4 kids. Or is it better left as a hobby, and for the love of it.

Any way tell me what you think or what might be best, you can say what you like i need the advice. You are all avid woodies so you ould now more than me.

Regards Jamie

If you wanted to look at some of my work then go here. http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=31028

[echnidna]

The cabinet makers don't pay much so you would possibly be looking at a noticeable income reduction, so keep it as a hobby.

Though theres no reason you shouldn't have a profitable hobby.

From tree surgeon to specialty timber supplier might be a better move though milling timber is hard heavy yakka but it might mix very well with your hobby (as a boutique furniture maker.)

Even just supplying turning and pen blanks might be worthwhile.
You should at least, make enough money to get some new toys.

[MathewA]

Furniture makers make no money but like what they do, but they don't hire help cause they make no money. Cabinet makers make no money and hate what they do. These are generalities so there'll be a few exceptions, but they will be few and far between. Those are your choices.

I'll give you an example of how lousy this trade is (great hobby though). There's a guy that worked at the shop where I now work. He's just left to go and work for a very high end shop in Toowoomba. It's the shop I was asking about earlier but the name escapes me right now. The guy (I don't want to mention any names) says it a job you waite all your life for (sounds pretty good eh). This shop has been looking Australia wide for the very best furniture makers to work on projects that are worth more than you can imagine. This shop has offices worldwide selling to only the richest clients... (Sounds even better) Guess how much he's willing to pay a master woodworker (the guy who just left our shop). You'd think 45 maybe 50 thousand (after all he wants the very best right). Nope he'll pay a whopping 35 thousand a year, great salary if you live with your parents. I dunno, maybe you think that's not bad pay for 20 plus years experience. He'll be able to brag to all his mates down at the local tavern that he has a job you only dream about, but he'll have to borrow the money to buy the beer that he wants to drink with his mates at the tavern.

[martrix]

Furniture makers make no money but like what they do, but they don't hire help cause they make no money. Cabinet makers make no money and hate what they do. These are generalities so there'll be a few exceptions, but they will be few and far between. Those are your choices.

I'll give you an example of how lousy this trade is (great hobby though). There's a guy that worked at the shop where I now work. He's just left to go and work for a very high end shop in Toowoomba. It's the shop I was asking about earlier but the name escapes me right now. The guy (I don't want to mention any names) says it a job you waite all your life for (sounds pretty good eh). This shop has been looking Australia wide for the very best furniture makers to work on projects that are worth more than you can imagine. This shop has offices worldwide selling to only the richest clients... (Sounds even better) Guess how much he's willing to pay a master woodworker (the guy who just left our shop). You'd think 45 maybe 50 thousand (after all he wants the very best right). Nope he'll pay a whopping 35 thousand a year, great salary if you live with your parents. I dunno, maybe you think that's not bad pay for 20 plus years experience. He'll be able to brag to all his mates down at the local tavern that he has a job you only dream about, but he'll have to borrow the money to buy the beer that he wants to drink with his mates at the tavern.

you are spot on Matt, it baffles me why it is this way..
It's got to be the lowest paid trade these days:(

[Lignum]

I know the workshop in question and it stagers me they pay only 35k. I would hope thats take home with a rise after a qualifying period and insentives along the way. Bouchers work is the ducks nuts sold for exorbadent prices. No wonder it took him so long to find someone to fill the vacancy as their are heaps of good woodies around capable of doing that work but all have brains that they can earn better elswhere with their talents

[Terry1]

G/day Garell,There doesn't seem to be much money in the furniture making game on wages at least.I know a couple of fellows who work in a place called Billy Tea Furniture and they send it (furniture )all over the place and seem to be always busy but dont make any money.I make alot of stuff and people ask why don't you sell it,but I wouldn't make anything like I can make laying bricks and doing a couple of "spec"homes each year so it will remain a hobby until my back gives up some day I suppose.I wouldn't work at a quick enough pace to make a quid anyway.If I tried to do that it wouldn't seem like a hobby I don't think.

[journeyman Mick]

Jamie,
I loved woodworking at school, but wasn't exceptionally good at it. Did other things with my life and found myself, by chance, labouring for friends who were owner building. I worked with a very good carpenter and it rekindled my interest in wood working. Kept working with him, then a few others as a carpenter then went out on my own, got my trade papers and contracting license etc etc.

I'm now at the stage where I made enough money from building work to buy our own place, build a shed and buy some cabinetmaking gear (panel saw, edgebander and hinge borer/inserter) plus some more gear for solid timber work. I'm still not doing the stuff I really want to do (solid timber furniture commissions) although I've had a few small jobs. I figure it's going to take another 10 years or so before I'm at a stage where I can afford to chase after that market and it's taken almost 20 years to get to where I am now.

I may have been able to do it quicker but I don't like taking risks and I hate paying interest. It's been a very round-about journey but it beats working in an office or for someone else and I've been able to stock up on a lot of tools and even managed to make some furniture for our own place (still lots to do though :o ).

There's a lot of different ways to get to places, but first you need to identify where you really want to get. Do you want the stress of self employment? If so, you may be better off hanging out your shingle as a tree lopper, and making $$ that way, building up a business which you can sell (meanwhile stockpiling a lot of timber) and then set yourself up with the proceeds of this sale. Then maybe working partime as a tree surgeon and doing the furniture making part time, until hopefuly it can support you and the family.

Alternatively you may not enjoy turning your hobby into your work. In this case you may be better off keeping it as a hobby but trying to make some money from it.

Mick

[Wongo]

Keep it as a hobby and enjoy it.

I just got back from the Blue Mountains. Every time we are up there we go to this fine woodwork shop in Leura. I saw a few beautiful hall tables nicely done by someone very talented.

Let do a case study. This one is made of silky oak and tas blackwood. 3 beautiful drawers with handcut dovetails. Nicely polished and the guy must be a professional. Is $1495 too expensive?

Lets say it takes the guy 1 week to make the table. They shop sells the table for him and charges 50% commission. The guy gets $750 for it, minus say $200 cost and he has $550 in his pocket.

Now that’s one week down and 51 to go.

I am sorry I made up a lot of numbers here but I think you should get the idea.

[MathewA]

you are spot on Matt, it baffles me why it is this way..
It's got to be the lowest paid trade these days:(


If yer baffled about that you'll love this story then. I worked at another shop with a fellow. He was telling me that when he was taking his appreticeship the tafe school had a poster up on the wall for all to see that ranked all the trades for many different catagories. Cabinet making was the lowest paid trade. I did my trade in Canada where (I guess) with the lower cost of living and higher wages it's a trade you can live off. But here it's the other way round low wages and a high cost of living. I'm absolutely dumb founded as to why he didn't walk out right then after reading that and look at doing something else. To compound my dumb foundedness as to why he continued he also told me his father works up in the mines as a high tension line electrician and takes home 120,000/year and is constantly after him to go up north and get an appreticeship with his company. When he told me that I nearly slpped him up side the head with his rubber mallet. Oh ya he also can't afford to live on his own so he lives with his mother - he's 29 years old.

I was very tempted to ask him if I could have his fathers phone number but my wife has said that if I go up to the mines she's going back to Canada. No worries though, I'll think of something else.

[Wood Butcher]

Mathew, spend a few of years do some uni study and become a secondary teacher. They start at $45k in QLD. Thats what I'm doing. oh and 9 weeks of holidays is pretty good too!!!

[martrix]

If yer baffled about that you'll love this story then. I worked at another shop with a fellow. He was telling me that when he was taking his appreticeship the tafe school had a poster up on the wall for all to see that ranked all the trades for many different catagories. Cabinet making was the lowest paid trade. I did my trade in Canada where (I guess) with the lower cost of living and higher wages it's a trade you can live off. But here it's the other way round low wages and a high cost of living. I'm absolutely dumb founded as to why he didn't walk out right then after reading that and look at doing something else. To compound my dumb foundedness as to why he continued he also told me his father works up in the mines as a high tension line electrician and takes home 120,000/year and is constantly after him to go up north and get an appreticeship with his company. When he told me that I nearly slpped him up side the head with his rubber mallet. Oh ya he also can't afford to live on his own so he lives with his mother - he's 29 years old.

I was very tempted to ask him if I could have his fathers phone number but my wife has said that if I go up to the mines she's going back to Canada. No worries though, I'll think of something else.

it's depressing:( ...........but...i just cracked a Lager...so GO PIES!
ignorant bliss for the rest of the afternoon:)

[Garell]

Thank you to every one who replyed to my post. I appreciate it.

The indusrty is as I thought, well under paid for todays standards of living. However the tree industry can be just as bad.

I had thought of being a teacher as Wood butcher mentioned. However I just spent 8 weeks at a secondary school doing woodwork (very basic, just did it to use some of there machines for a project because i did not have them that big) and you should have seen what the kids do to tools, benches and there own work. It would break your heart. It did to me and the teaching idear went out the window.

Mick started labouring the turned to carpentry. Well that was my other thought. Do the building thing, I love the outdoors and building, best of both worlds. Its probably the next best thing.

I was going to buy a lucus mill and colaborate with the the tree industry and salvage timber that would normaly be turned into fire wood. But when you buy the mill which is $8000 to $12000 (of the top of my head) then you have to have some where to store the timber, thats buying a block of land, then a truck to cart it all, the cost is just to great, i have looked deep into it, if you had a boss that was willing to do it as apart of the buisness then yea but not on ya own, not with a family. If you won tats then go for it.

So a summery of all that is I think I might try a few builders and see how I go. There is a shortage of them I think.

Thanks again to every one for replying and your knowledge on the subject.

Regards Jamie

[Auld Bassoon]

Matthew,

I hope that you're joking! I would have thought that a salary like that would be for a Saturday morning job...

[MathewA]

Thank you to every one who replyed to my post. I appreciate it.

The indusrty is as I thought, well under paid for todays standards of living. However the tree industry can be just as bad.

I had thought of being a teacher as Wood butcher mentioned. However I just spent 8 weeks at a secondary school doing woodwork (very basic, just did it to use some of there machines for a project because i did not have them that big) and you should have seen what the kids do to tools, benches and there own work. It would break your heart. It did to me and the teaching idear went out the window.

Mick started labouring the turned to carpentry. Well that was my other thought. Do the building thing, I love the outdoors and building, best of both worlds. Its probably the next best thing.

I was going to buy a lucus mill and colaborate with the the tree industry and salvage timber that would normaly be turned into fire wood. But when you buy the mill which is $8000 to $12000 (of the top of my head) then you have to have some where to store the timber, thats buying a block of land, then a truck to cart it all, the cost is just to great, i have looked deep into it, if you had a boss that was willing to do it as apart of the buisness then yea but not on ya own, not with a family. If you won tats then go for it.

So a summery of all that is I think I might try a few builders and see how I go. There is a shortage of them I think.

Thanks again to every one for replying and your knowledge on the subject.

Regards Jamie


I'm in the same position as you - I want something different. Difference is I've done what you want to do and I know its crap. The other thing you have to be thinking of is, take a look around most builiding sites. You don't see a lot of people over 45, and most over that age look fairly beat up. There's a reason for that. One thing I've found since moving here is that the building trades are far harder on the body than in Canada. Letting a machine of some sort take over the majority of the physical labour isn't an option here and it shows. Once you hit the 40's it's down hill rapidly for the body if you're in construction.

[MathewA]

Matthew,

I hope that you're joking! I would have thought that a salary like that would be for a Saturday morning job...


Joking - what's an even bigger joke is I make less.

[Garell]

I cant put my hands on the official price list for the mill bit it is around $8000 + . Problem is no one is willing to pay $100 an hour to have timber milled. The usable timber you get will depend on the health of the tree. So its a bit of a gamble.

As far as the building trade I agree, it is very labour intensive. But you try climbing trees for a living, climbing out on branches and pruning them and throughing them down to the groung crew, or doing a big removal, blocking down sections with a sthill 88 with a 3ft bar on it. Mate thats labour intensive. So the phisical side does not worry me.

I am 27 and still up in arms as to what to do, and, to boot have 4 great kids under the age of 10. So unfortunately my ambitions are limited to what I have to do to sport a family.

But enough of that. Its getting harder to change carears in this day en age.

Jamie

[Greolt]

You don't see a lot of people over 45, and most over that age look fairly beat up. .......................... Once you hit
the 40's it's down hill rapidly for the body if you're in construction. You been reading my mail????:eek:

[mickp]

keep it as a hobby

[MathewA]

As far as the building trade I agree, it is very labour intensive. But you try climbing trees for a living, climbing out on branches and pruning them and throughing them down to the groung crew, or doing a big removal, blocking down sections with a sthill 88 with a 3ft bar on it. Mate thats labour intensive. So the phisical side does not worry me.

I am 27 and still up in arms as to what to do, and, to boot have 4 great kids under the age of 10. So unfortunately my ambitions are limited to what I have to do to sport a family.

But enough of that. Its getting harder to change carears in this day en age.

Jamie

Trust me I know all about tree work - did a few years with my brother, It's f()cking hard work.


I can't disagree with you more. Yes you have 4 kids but you're only 27 years old DONT WAIT it will only get harder. Forget the trades go back to school - your options increase tenfold and more. And if after you've gone to school you still want to be a cabinet maker or whatever, you still can. But if you go for being a woodworker now that's all you will ever be, unless you want to strive for being a janitor later. The wood trades have a path that only leads down. Schooling allows you to reach for the stars.

[Lignum]

MathewA should get out of the industry. He seems to be dark and down on it as he constantly has a go at it. Their would be thousands of furniture/cabinetmakers here in Aus who love what they do and with some overtime take home some good money. As iv said before i know cabinet fixers who take home in excess of 1k a week and furniture makers with some over time over 800. It mightnt be what IT people or Brain Surgeons take home but its a great way to make a living doing something you love.

[Garell]

I could not agree with you more MathewA, schooling can take you to the stars. Only of you can get the right course that is done at night. My wife cant work as 2 of our children are at home ( 9months old) so full time school is out of the question.

I also agree with Lignum that its good to work in something you love. Dont get me wrong I love trees and the money atm is good making around 40k a year, but just getting sick of it. But I might have a new lease on life when I go back tomorow after a 12 day break. I would love to go back to school but to do what I dont know.

Thanks again

Jamie

[Harry72]

Lignum, even though the cabinet makers you speak of earn excess a $1k pw... the average factory shiftwork job will pay that without any OT.
I'd love to take up my commission work full time but the truth is I can earn more profit with 1 12hr OT($550)than I can making large cabinets, our aussie throw away nature dictates it.
I think the only way you could make a reasonable wage from furniture would be to specialise in one or two piece's on a mass production basis, like chairs and tables made from crapiarta because thats what most everyday people buy.

[Lignum]

I agree with you Harry, but a 12 hour factory shift dosnt interest me, but 12 hours behind a work bench dose:) I know its a hard industry, but all im saying it isnt all doom and gloom like some here are making out

[journeyman Mick]

Jamie,
if you fancy working away for a few months (leave of abscence form work?) you could probably come to North Queensland to do some cyclone clean up work. I know that climbers here were getting much better than 40K per year before the cyclone. Got a contact in the industry of you're interested.

Matthew,
yeah working on the tools when you get past 40 gets harder, but hopefully by then you've maneuverd yourself into a position where you don't need to work too hard. I looked at the teaching too, got halfway through my degree but realised that it really wasn't for me. I've been self employed for most of my life and wasn't ready to work for something as inflexible as the education department.

I guess it comes down to what you enjoy. More money would always be nice but if it comes at the expense of your sanity or quality of life then it's not worth it. If you have a contractor's license, a van or ute, basic tools and a garage you can get ready cut and edged board and make a very good living knocking up kitchens ($70 - 100K P.A). It's not fine woodworking but it's not real hard work either and at least you get to tax deduct all your toys.

Mick

[Harry72]

Yep I agree to Lig, I would enjoy working behind my bench for 12hrs more than working on a furnace for 12hrs too, but my current financial situation wont allow it... might soon tho!

[Terry1]

Hello Mathew,I just noticed your post about there not been many tradesmen over the age of 45 on site.Maybe that applies to big sites or to where you are but down here (Riverina region)there are lots of men in that age bracket in the game.I read a piece about the average age of bricklayers in Vic been around 40.The kids around here seem to be staying at school longer and don't really seem interested in the building industry as a career choice despite the various government places set up trying to encourage apprentiships in the building game.

[RufflyRustic]

Mick - now that's an amazing offer.

Guys, here's another point of view/ current experience

My job at present is in doubt due to an IT workplace restructure. I have no idea what I'll be doing when I go back to work in June. Let me clarify, it's not the security or pay that's in doubt - yet, but what my duties and position title will be. I have to apply for positions in the new structure or else take on 'project' work. So even on holidays, I find I'm worrying about my job, self-worth at a place where I've worked for over 16 years. Is it any wonder I bury myself in sawdust every chance I get?

I love working with wood. I'm passionate about it, I practically live and breathe it. Don't get me started on it cause I'll talk till my voice gives out. Even HWMBO is realising how passionate I am, he bought me a lovely decent expensive drill and now a 1hp dust extractor as well. He even brings home some cypress for me now and then.

Recently I came across another female woodworker whose running her own business partnership in woodworking and furniture restoration. She's younger than me and just amazing. Naturally all this is making me re-think my career choice and wondering if my strong feelings would still survive if I went into woodwork full time, whether I could make a living from it here in Toowoomba. I honestly don't know.

As a result, I'm finding this thread extremely applicable and interesting.

cheers
Wendy

[echnidna]

Mick - now that's an amazing offer.

Guys, here's another point of view/ current experience

My job at present is in doubt due to an IT workplace restructure. I have no idea what I'll be doing when I go back to work in June. Let me clarify, it's not the security or pay that's in doubt - yet, but what my duties and position title will be. I have to apply for positions in the new structure or else take on 'project' work. So even on holidays, I find I'm worrying about my job, self-worth at a place where I've worked for over 16 years. Is it any wonder I bury myself in sawdust every chance I get?

I love working with wood. I'm passionate about it, I practically live and breathe it. Don't get me started on it cause I'll talk till my voice gives out. Even HWMBO is realising how passionate I am, he bought me a lovely decent expensive drill and now a 1hp dust extractor as well. He even brings home some cypress for me now and then.

Recently I came across another female woodworker whose running her own business partnership in woodworking and furniture restoration. She's younger than me and just amazing. Naturally all this is making me re-think my career choice and wondering if my strong feelings would still survive if I went into woodwork full time, whether I could make a living from it here in Toowoomba. I honestly don't know.

As a result, I'm finding this thread extremely applicable and interesting.

cheers
Wendy

Wendy,
Is it practical for you to do some home based IT work,
even just doing websites as an income source
so you can follow your heart and get into pro woodworking.

Your woodworking skills have improved so rapidly that I'm sure you would make a go of it.

Success really depends on your product line AND your marketing skills.

and unyielding determination to make it all work

[RufflyRustic]

Thanks for the comments Echidna

Lots of Food for thought there - marketing skills - noted Thanks.

I have the determination, but I also realise it's more than just a few people saying "you should sell these, go to the markets, set up a business". Easy to say, much much much harder to do and earn a living from it.

It's also scary as all get out not having that regular security of a paycheck coming in, but probably more rewarding...

Thanks
Wendy

[CameronPotter]

I haven't had too many people say that I "Should sell those..." but plenty of people have offered to take them off my hands free of charge. :rolleyes:

Anyway, one thing that I am always wary of is turning your hobby into your profession - I find that once I NEED to do something it becomes a chore. It is something that I would keep in mind.

Mind you, that is maybe just me. :o

That all being said, if you aren't enjoying what you are doing (or feeling comfortable with it), then maybe it is time to try something else.

As for going back to school... I know some great mates who went back to school after working in industry (and deciding that mechanic work was going to lead them to an early grave). They did engineering - their practical experience was a great help, but their maths needed a bit of work. Anyway, they now have really good jobs (I mean REALLY good) and they are loving it. A few years of being poor really paid off. Mind you, they also had the luxury to be able to move back in with their parents to reduce costs. Study allowance isn't huge, but it is enough to live off - just.

Cam

[MathewA]

A bit of an update on what I said earlier. The fellow I was talking about going to the shop in Toowoomba is starting at 35000/year but is expecting, though he doesn't know when, to have his salary increase to between 40,000 and 50,000/year if all works out, which is obviously more than fair. Just found that out today so not all is too bad in the woodworking field. I wouldn't want that shop to be labelled in an unfair way.

Also, I have a tendency to be a bit vague at times though I stated at the beginning... I'm bagging on cabinetmaking not furniture making. I know a lot of furniture makers and all of them make very little money but they love what they do; all also work for themselves. I also know a lot of cabinetmakers and few if any like what they do, and some own they're own shops.

[HJ0]

Hearing lots about this furniture guru in Toowoomba, has anyone ever seen any pictures of his work. Or is it only for the eyes of the rich and famous.

HJ0

[RufflyRustic]

Thanks for the advice Cameron. I have often wondered if I'd end up losing my passion if I did take up woodworking fulltime.

Matt - thanks for the update.

HJO - no promises, but I might, just might be able to..... but don't hold your breath.


I talked with my new boss to day, made a huge difference, let's just say my passion for wood will still be my passion for wood and hobby, for the time being. Besides, it'd be a little on the silly side to give up the chance for paid maternity leave (no, not yet guys)

cheers
Wendy

[Garell]

Well i can't beleve the amount of people that replyed to my original question.

I have given it all some considerable thought and from what I had happen at work today I think that its confermed. I will be looking into the wood industry, as a carpenter, or cabnitmaker or kitchen fitter I don't care. But its a definate to get out of where I am at the moment. Basicly I got abused by one boss for doing something that another boss askes me to do then was told I should have known better. I can't win.

So I'm officialy looking for work. Grrrrr. Havent told them I'm leaving yet though, but every one will know there stupidity when i do:cool: .

[RufflyRustic]

Go for it Garell! Sounds like it's the right time for you to make such a change.

Good luck and I hope you can keep us updated. It's been a very enlightening discussion. Thank you for starting the thread.

cheers
Wendy

[zenwood]

There are some case studies of people making a successful woodworking businesses in recent issues of Australian Wood Review:

"If At First You Don't Succeed", by Richard Raffan, Issue 48, p. 24,
"Risky Business" by Richard Raffan, Issue 49, p. 24, and
"Manna Mission" by Linda Nathan, Issue 50, p. 24.For me, even if I could get the same pay doing woodworking, I think it would change my attitude towards an enjoyable hobby if I was required to do it for 8 hrs (or 10, whatever) every day. I keep it as a relaxing hobby to get the mind thinking about something totally different, and there's no rush to get things finished, just spend as much time as I want pondering things, and getting the right degree of perfection for me.

[keith53]

For me, even if I could get the same pay doing woodworking, I think it would change my attitude towards an enjoyable hobby if I was required to do it for 8 hrs (or 10, whatever) every day. I keep it as a relaxing hobby to get the mind thinking about something totally different, and there's no rush to get things finished, just spend as much time as I want pondering things, and getting the right degree of perfection for me.

Good point Zen. I'm probably in the same boat. Its not that I don't enjoy the work I do - just the environment I work in and the space cadets I work with (not all, of course). Mind you a good raddishing might improve some of them but I think that's illegal nowadays.

I don't know if the enjoyment level would be the same if I were to be a full time woodworker (I suspect not). Yesterday afternoon was a classic example. I finish work at 3pm and so have till 6pm when swmbo gets home to engage in some quality shed time. I've got a lot of projects and ideas on the go (damn that Woodwork Channel on the internet) but I spent most of the time sketching and doing some minor re-arrangements in the shed. The time really flies and I don't think about anything else (all right, I did give some thought to what to get this year at the Brisbane WWW show).

That's got to be good for the soul. Personally, I think its one of the best therapies around but I think that feeling may be jepoardised if I were to do it full time. [End of ramble.] :D

Cheers,
Keith

[dan_tom]

Hi All,
Garell, go for it! It can take a bit of searching but suitable, realistic income jobs are out there.

My story...
I had been in a "transition phase" working as a storeman earning good money thanks to shift loadings. I had been applying to pretty much any unqualified building industry job I could find to get into the industry. Danielle found an ad for a position with a small company making gates and other one-off items... all out of recycled hardwood, using traditional joinery techniques! I applied for the job and got it based on the photo album of our projects. The gates are the bread and butter but we also make pretty much anything else to custom order. The money is good and do what I love every day.
Started two weeks ago. :D :D :D

Cheers
Tom
PS. just read over this and realised that it sounds like something from an AA meeting, I post it anyway and have a drink later in the morning!:D

[Lignum]

For me, even if I could get the same pay doing woodworking, I think it would change my attitude towards an enjoyable hobby if I was required to do it for 8 hrs (or 10, whatever)



Good point Zen, but their are those like me who first thing in the morning walk into a room full of timber and machines and projects on the go etc; and think "it dosnt get any beter than this" I love getting up first thing and getting stuck into it. And you talk of keeping relaxed and not rushing, but its such a buz when you do the last all nighter on a job to be totaly exausted but in front of you is a magic peice of furniture that will be delivered to some very greatfull and excited customers. I love it:)

We should do a poll to see who loves getting up early and realy looks foward to getting stuck into their job and just before going to bed has only the thought of getting up and getting stuck back into it. And whether or not in their declining years they would look back and say "dam, wish i had of worked with timber and not worried so much about the extra dollars"

In a thread a while back regarding IT it was clear a great percentage of members are into that for a living and making lots more money than full time woodies, but a huge percentage of the population take home around $550 - $750 a week, and id rather be making furniture for that than alot of other similar paying jobs.

Toms a great example, he has chased and found his way into the industry and is very happy. How many others reading this are very happy with their jobs? i know i am and wouldnt be doing anything else.

So just like what Tom said, go for it, you wont get rich, but you will never ever be out of work. These days if you loose your job when your over 40 you can find your self on the scrap heap, but if you can make good solid furniture you will always find work right up until retirement:)

[echnidna]

beyond retirement Lignum

[Lignum]

beyond retirement Lignum



Bob im talking retirement from this mortal coil;)

[dazzler]

Hi Garell

It really is a hard decision to make about the future.

These are my thoughts:rolleyes:

You obviously love your woodworking and there is probably a future for you there if thats the direction you wish to go. Unfortunately you have 4 kids and a wife you must adore and need to support so that adds much stress to any decision. Being 27 there is a while for you to jump in.

You also dont have any recognised trade skills so any employer will only offer the most basic of wages in the industry despite any great skills you may bring.

What about putting a plan on paper so that you have a solid base to go from.

If it was me I would do this;

1. Keep my current job. Stability is good for the soul.
2. Do as much woodwork courses as I can.
3. Start a small woodworking business where you sell at markets, shows etc. Maybe build a trailer that opens up to display all the goods. Get used to talking with people, have a pictorial of your larger pieces.
4. Do a small business course. Get the book "the E-myth revisited" which is about small business and why many fail, particularly if the business is something that is also a passion.
5. Build some nice stuff to sell and work out what it costs to produce each piece, what sells and what doesnt.
6. Make stuff the others dont. (One day we wont be able to drive down the road for all the damned coffee mills being made:p )
7. Get used to BAS and all the other small business crud that is not actually building the stuff.:p

My plan would be on a timetable so that I have gained valuable woodworking/business skills between now and when all the kids are at school. This would free mum up to go back to work, even if its only part time while the kids are at school, to supplement the family income.

Now even if you decide that the small business side is not for you at least you now have added skills that an employer would want.

"you can do BAS:p , you know about tax:p ....get in here:D "

Anyways thats how I would do it.

Good luck mate


dazzler

[Garell]

Hi all

Dazzler you are right, it is not a bad idear, I have thought about building projects and taking them to markets, was going to do toys mostly. Thats what I like to make (haven't been able to any for a while). The ony trouble with the job I am in, is that, yea its secure but that does not outway the treatment I recieve from my employer. I am hoping to be as lucky as Tom and score a job, using a portfolio of projects. I spent all day yesterday ringing every one in the local paper, from carpenters to cabnetmakers, I almost had some luck but its quiet at the moment. I have some mate's looking for me also.

Trouble is I have been asked to re-apply to the local council that I left from a year ago. I had thought of going back, there are new people on the crew so it might not be as bad as when I left. Its very secure, and I can get as much timber as I like. That way I can do the woodies stuff on the RDO's and weekends. Use it as a steping stone.

So I think that if I cant get a job after ringing around then I might have to bide my time till council advertise agin which is this month, and do it just for the interum.

I am so dam confused what to do. Torn from the love of trees and timber, the outdoors and the shed. But its a definate to get out of the private garden I work in at the moment. I am not happy there the way I thought I might have been and I dont get very good treatment. You never think that you are doing the right thing, because they are never there. When they are its no bells and whistles let me tell you.

Any way I can only see what happens, It will sort itself out in the wash.

Nice thought, to wake up and enjoy going to work, havent had that for a long time, maby I will get it back. I like the weekends, lots of shed time, and family.

Got that if my chest. :D

Jamie

[dazzler]

Talkin councils and all.:rolleyes:

When I was an apprentice on the council my job at 8.45 was to boil the billy with an oxy torch.

Once it was boiling the head mechanic would come over and put in the tea....billy tea that is, and we could only drink it black.

The boss thought to help things along he would install an Electric Urn.

I thought it was cool until I saw it go tumbling down the driveway followed by the 'workers' who wouldnt come back until the billy came back:rolleyes: .

Ahhhhh councils:D

dazzler

[Shedhand]

"Its getting harder to change carears in this day en age."

Ha! Try changin' ponies at 54. :(

I've worked the past 20 years - until March 2005 when I retired - in industrial relations and politics. ;)

When I left school I wanted to do be an apprentice cabinet maker (in those days it was a respected trade) but there were none avaialable. :o

Now I've retired, I'm finally working with wood :D . I love it. And I'd love it if had to do it for a living. Trouble is, my work background and age precludes me from working in the trade. :o
If someone offered me 3 days a week in the industry, at 18 bucks an hour nett, I'd snap it up. ;)
Cheers

[Daddles]

Okay, here's a hypothetical for you lot -

Me.
I've built a couple of boats, but I'm still a rough carpenter, not a fine carpenter.
No trade qualifications.
Never worked in the wood trade.
age - near enough to 50.
Could only work two or three days a week.

Any hope of a job in the woodies world? If so, what sort?

Richard

Of course, there's always the chance that someone will publish me with a huge advance:D I've two new novels about to hit the market trail that redine the word 'haunted' :eek:

[attie]

"you are spot on Matt, it baffles me why it is this way..
It's got to be the lowest paid trade these days:(<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->__________________

cheer's Martrix."

My son will qualify as a chef next month at a xxxx star resort on the Gold Coast and will then go onto a salary of $490 [gross] a week. Like furniture making, it's the love of the trade, not the reward that keeps the dedicated going. His brother works as a carpenter on a wage and brings home almost twice that amount with just 4hrs overtime a week.

Wayne

[martrix]

My son will qualify as a chef next month at a xxxx star resort on the Gold Coast and will then go onto a salary of $490 [gross] a week. Like furniture making, it's the love of the trade, not the reward that keeps the dedicated going. His brother works as a carpenter on a wage and brings home almost twice that amount with just 4hrs overtime a week.


Wayne


How many hours though?

[attie]

Minimum of 38 Matrix. They do not get paid for anything beyond that, they get time off in leau but must take it within three months or loose it. As he is still an apprentice he doesn't get overtime because they would have to pay it, that is covered by those on a salary.