Ubeaut White Shellac (dewaxed)

[tktran]

Hello,

I'm considering buying Ubeaut's White Shellac, as recommended by fellow forum members, to finish my Maple-veneered loudspeakers.

I chose the veneer based on the fact that the raw maple seemed to match the couch, which is a cream colour. Except I forgot to take into account that my precious blonde veneer will likely change colour once finished.

So what I'm aiming to do is to give it a glassy high gloss finish with minimal darkening. Apart from poring melted plastic on it (ala Rustin's Plastic Coating), I'm not sure how else to do this. :D

Anyway I digress. Will the White Shellac do the trick? Exactly how do I apply it?

http://www.ubeaut.com.au/dewaxed.html


Application
"Dewaxed White Shellac can be applied with a pad (or rubber) the same was as you would French Polishing, it can also be applied with a brush and high or low pressure spray equipment."

Unfortunately I've never French polished before.

I'm an amateur, and have only used (Rustin's) Danish oil and (Liberon Black Bison) fine paste wax. Both were easy to apply with great results.

regards,
Thanh

[Gumby]

It will be fine. Unless you need a more durable finish and then you could get the Hard Shellac.

It's easy to apply and I'd strongly suggest you get a copy of neil's Polisher's Handbook at the same time. (Online or find a supplier over there)

You don't need to be a French polisher either. Just follow the instructions. I usually thin it down 50% with Metho and find it is easier to get a smooth finish. It needs more coats but it dries almost instantly.:D

Whatever you do, try it out on a scrap piece first.

[Iain]

I think hard shellac would be a better option, I dilute about 5:1 with 100% meths and apply in long strokes with a cotton rag formed into a ball, a bit like a rubber but not the same.
Make sure the cloth is not folded where you intend to polish.
After about 3-5 coats apply EEE paste and rub of and follow with traditional wax.
The finish is simple and although requiring a little effort, is easier than french polishing, this will give you a high gloss finish that doesn't look like plastic, mainly because it isn't:rolleyes:
You should get change out of $50 and have a heaps left over for future projects.

[markharrison]

I think hard shellac would be a better option,

Why? These are speakers, not table tops.

I thin it 50% and brush it on. Then I use 400 grit wet and dry to level out the finish followed by another coat then 0000 steel wool and wax.

[tktran]

Thanks for all the replies.

So I will need a wax or other topcoat over the White Shellac?

I was afraid of that. My experience with wax is that is changes the colour. [edit: That Liberon Black Bison clear fine paste wax that I used is a very slight yellow! :( ]

Are any of the Ubeaut waxes waterclear? That's what I'm looking for. That glassy high gloss look on grand pianos...

Here are the maple loudspeakers in question:

[Auld Bassoon]

Hi Tktran,

Assuming that the underlying shellac is perfectly smooth - e.g. rubbed down to 2000 or even 2500 grit W&D with a large cork (for preference) block, then polished with EEE from uBeaut, our host, then a natural finish traditional wax from our host here, buffed with a lambswool wheel will give a stunning result - and look natural (aka the old master's work) without looking "plastic".

However, if you want a true 'piano' like finish, then's it's the old French Polish for you boyo...

[Gumby]

try it without the wax first. I never use wax on the jewellery boxes I make and use the shellac alone with a final coat of EEE polish. Brilliant gloss shine.

If you have to fill some grain, use an undiluted first coat of shellac to act as a filler.

The finish is all in preparation. Get it silky smooth with at least 800 grit using a random orbital sander and you'll be happy. As has been said, a few coats of diluted shellac, then a very light rub, then the final coat and EEE for the finish.

Get some traditional wax as well when you buy the shellac. It can be used on othe items and again, you can try it on some scrap first.

[Iain]

Why? These are speakers, not table tops.
Because on something that can be handled or moved I prefer the harder finish.
Cost is about the same and at the end of the day, unless it is 'never' going to be touched, it is my finish of choice.

[Gumby]

Because on something that can be handled or moved I prefer the harder finish.
Cost is about the same and at the end of the day, unless it is 'never' going to be touched, it is my finish of choice.

I agree. ;)

[markharrison]

Because on something that can be handled or moved I prefer the harder finish.
Cost is about the same and at the end of the day, unless it is 'never' going to be touched, it is my finish of choice.

Fair enough answer. One thing to bear in mind though is that the white dewaxed has less yellowing effect than the hard shellac.

[RETIRED]

Thanks for all the replies.

So I will need a wax or other topcoat over the White Shellac?

I was afraid of that. My experience with wax is that is changes the colour. [edit: That Liberon Black Bison clear fine paste wax that I used is a very slight yellow! :( ]

Are any of the Ubeaut waxes waterclear? That's what I'm looking for. That glassy high gloss look on grand pianos...

Here are the maple loudspeakers in question:Fixed your picture. Nice job.

[greenie512]

TK, nice to see another speaker builder hanging out here; what type of veneer is that. Bunnings iron-on stuff or the real "macoy" and how do you find applying it?

I've never been successful with either. Have just come in from the shed where I’ve just started “veneering” a pair of small BR boxes for my Fostex FE126’s. I’ve been using 1.5mm ply/veneer which I find does not give me any hassle but of course there is a visible edge but from a metre away this isn’t really an issue.
<o></o>
Third picture is of my current project which needs veneering also – right, dual full range units, left top box is back loaded horn for the Fostex and under it is the BR box I’m currently veneering.

Cheers - Phil

[tktran]

Hi Phil,

Yeah I get around, but Madisound, DIYAudio, and Ubeaut are my favourite forums.

I could not find any pre-glued sheets at WA's Bunning stores. So I bought the 'real' stuff. 2.4 x 1.2m sheets, comes rolled up in a big box.

My first speaker used raw Tassie Myrtle veneer. The second speaker is covered with paper-backed (American) Rock Maple. I apply both using the dried PVA-glue iron-on technique as described by Pete Mazz.
(http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=238062#post238062)
Since that time I have also found an online video describing this technique:
http://www.liwoodworkers.org/media/video/VeneeringPart1.wmv

I've never tried it with contact cement, but the dry-PVA works fairly well. After using both types of veneer I prefer the paper backed. Raw veneer tends to soak up a lot of glue and becomes curled during the process. This makes it harder to apply flat (especially over long 1+m lengths), and if you miss a spot will become bubbled, and grow over time.

Daryl Nixon, a fellow speakerbuilder from QLD recommended Brims (www.brims.com.au) to me. I'm not sure if they do the paper-backed variety, but that is the type I would recommend.

A good buddy of mine built some floorstanders using the pre-glued veneer. It cuts down the amount of time spent, but the range of veneers is more limited.

Here are some pictures of the edges of the maple. Paper backed veneer is 0.5mm thick, so the edges slightly more visible than the raw stuff. The big advantage is that it is far easier to roll glue onto, and iron onto MDF.

I got mine from Cullity Timbers (WA) and have had dealt with Amerind, whom have an incredible range. There is some *really* nice (=expensive) stuff. Palisander is incredible and I love anything of the quilted variety...

My homepage has more details of my cabinet construction...

[greenie512]

TK, yep would agree with forums.

Have you found a Aussie supplier of paper backed veneers. I've had a brief look around but couldn't find any one.

Brims supply my MDF, ply/veneer but don't do paperbacked.

Cheers - Phil

[redwood]

Since that time I have also found an online video describing this technique:
http://www.liwoodworkers.org/media/video/VeneeringPart1.wmv

.. Thanh do you have the url for the second part of this vid. its interesting:)

[tktran]

Hi redwood.

I am not sure why the 2nd part is not linked on the video library. Long Island Woodworkers USED to have both parts on their website. I'm sure of it, because I've seen both videos (and have them backed up here on my computer).

Hi Phil,

Both Cullity Timbers and Amerind were able to supply me paper-backed veneer.

www.amerind.com.au (Australia wide), or

http://www.amerind.com.au/contact.htm#QLD

www.cullitytimbers.com.au (WA)

[greenie512]

TK, thanks for the information - I'll follow that up on my next veneering job.

Here's my veneering process/finished product I was working on this weekend.

http://www.greenie512.net/greenie512/html/veneering.html

Cheers - Phil

[tktran]

Hi Phil,

I've been checking out your website periodically for the last year or so. I really enjoy it.

This is a nice addition. Please keep up the great work!

regards,
Thanh

PS. Which is your favourite loudspeaker?

[greenie512]

PS. Which is your favourite loudspeaker?
TK - The Seas Thor TL's have yet to be bettered and remain my bench mark but don't hit the very lows on their own, so use the sub as well. However the Fostex FE166ES-R back loaded horn was a revelation as I'd never heard a full range or BLH before I built it - wish I hadn't sold them now!. Very impressed by DM's CAOW 1's - gawd I haven't got a house big enough.

Cheers - Phil

PS - Glad you like web site ... you always wonder who is viewing it - hummm think I'll add a guest book.

PPS - very tempted to buy the soon to be released Fostex FE208ES-R at Madisound but I'm guessing they'll need a HUGE BLH cabinet.