Where do I start - Kitchen Reno

[Grumpy John]

I'm doing a kitchen reno and would appreciate some pointers on the best way to go about it. I'll be ripping out all the existing cupboards and replacing them with new ones. I will be extending the section under the window by about 350 mm. The new cupboards will be arriving mid next week, is there any prep work that I could do to make things as smooth as possible. The house was built in 1995 and is on a concrete slab. I will be keeping the existing wall oven, gas cooktop and dishwasher as they are only about 18 months old. I will be using the same layout.


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[nrb]

I will be watching with interest as our daughter is about to do the sam
She is hoping to do it over the coming xmas holidays

[ian]

I'm doing a kitchen reno and would appreciate some pointers on the best way to go about it. I'll be ripping out all the existing cupboards and replacing them with new ones. I will be extending the section under the window by about 350 mm. The new cupboards will be arriving mid next week, is there any prep work that I could do to make things as smooth as possible. The house was built in 1995 and is on a concrete slab. I will be keeping the existing wall oven, gas cooktop and dishwasher as they are only about 18 months old. I will be using the same layout.

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Does this mean -- see picture above -- that the width between the cooktop and island is increasing by 350 mm, or there about.

There is a high probability that the floor material (vinyl or engineered flooring) has been cut to fit, so factor in replacing the entire floor back to some readily identifiable line where the change in material used or age will not be noticeable. I suggest you replace the flooring with a material that DOES NOT uses MDF as a substrate.

Are the new bench tops at exactly (+/- 0.5 mm) the same height as the existing?
are the new counter tops
laminated chipboard like the existing?
real stone -- e.g. granite / limestone / marble
engineered stone -- the very high silica content equates to a very hazardous dust

are you sure that person who measured the kitchen checked that the walls at bench top level are square? If this hasn't been allowed for, you will likely find that the tops need to be trimmed so that they fit. This will leave them short unless you have allowed extra length for trimming.

In a typical kitchen, the splash back -- tiled, glass, metal, etc -- is installed after the cabinets and counter tops and the joint sealed with a waterproof grout. On that basis expect damage to at least the first row of tiles.
Factor in replacing at least all of the first row of the tiled splash back. This could be a major headache especially if removing the tiles damages (likely) the gyprock boards.

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

What Ian said. :yes:

Particularly the parts about flooring, splashback and - although Ian didn't mention it - ceiling plaster & cornices. (There is an appalling trend to fit cabinetry and then plaster the kitchen/wet-areas. Cheaper for the initial builder, but doing a reno? :()

These are often overlooked and can add substantially to the cost of a 'simple reno.'

[Grumpy John]

Does this mean -- see picture above -- that the width between the cooktop and island is increasing by 350 mm, or there about.

Correct

There is a high probability that the floor material (vinyl or engineered flooring) has been cut to fit, so factor in replacing the entire floor back to some readily identifiable line where the change in material used or age will not be noticeable. I suggest you replace the flooring with a material that DOES NOT uses MDF as a substrate.

That has been allowed for Ian. I have plenty of vinyl planks left over from when the floor was laid, I do not envision this to be an issue.

Are the new bench tops at exactly (+/- 0.5 mm) the same height as the existing?

Probably not.
are the new counter tops
laminated chipboard like the existing?

Yes.
real stone -- e.g. granite / limestone / marble
engineered stone -- the very high silica content equates to a very hazardous dust

are you sure that person who measured the kitchen checked that the walls at bench top level are square? If this hasn't been allowed for, you will likely find that the tops need to be trimmed so that they fit. This will leave them short unless you have allowed extra length for trimming.

I am very confident in the measurements taken, but as a precaution the benchtops are not being measured and made until the floor cabinets are installed.

In a typical kitchen, the splash back -- tiled, glass, metal, etc -- is installed after the cabinets and counter tops and the joint sealed with a waterproof grout. On that basis expect damage to at least the first row of tiles.
Factor in replacing at least all of the first row of the tiled splash back. This could be a major headache especially if removing the tiles damages (likely) the gyprock boards.

The tiles are being removed and replaced with new.


Thank you for the timely response Ian, much appreciated

[Grumpy John]

What Ian said. :yes:

Particularly the parts about flooring, splashback and - although Ian didn't mention it - ceiling plaster & cornices. (There is an appalling trend to fit cabinetry and then plaster the kitchen/wet-areas. Cheaper for the initial builder, but doing a reno? :()

These are often overlooked and can add substantially to the cost of a 'simple reno.'

Thanks Skew. I must admit the job of finishing above the wall cabinets is a concern, hopefully I have come to the right place for advice :fingerscrossed:.

[ian]

Hi John

There is a high probability that the floor material (vinyl or engineered flooring) has been cut to fit, so factor in replacing the entire floor back to some readily identifiable line where the change in material used or age will not be noticeable. I suggest you replace the flooring with a material that DOES NOT uses MDF as a substrate.

That has been allowed for Ian. I have plenty of vinyl planks left over from when the floor was laid, I do not envision this to be an issue.

Ah, but if you do not take care, there be an obvious join between the newly installed vinyl planks and the existing floor. Not a good look for a freshly renovated kitchen.




In a typical kitchen, the splash back -- tiled, glass, metal, etc -- is installed after the cabinets and counter tops and the joint sealed with a waterproof grout. On that basis expect damage to at least the first row of tiles.
Factor in replacing at least all of the first row of the tiled splash back. This could be a major headache especially if removing the tiles damages (likely) the gyprock boards.

The tiles are being removed and replaced with new.

I strongly doubt that removing the tiles will not so damage the existing wall material that it needs to be replaced.
In that case, factor in new gyprock or wall board [blue board?] as a tiling substrate. That is unless the existing wall is something more substantial than gyprock or wall board.
Don't be surprised if you find mould at the back of the lower cabinets, so have enough full sized sheets of gyprock on hand for this eventuality.
I'm not sure, as the only kitchen renos I've done were to a fully double brick home, but I think that "proper practice" requires the walls to be completed and the joints sanded flush before the cabinets are installed.



good luck with the reno

[Grumpy John]

Day one.

So far there have been no nasty surprises or unexpected difficulties, but this is only day one :D.

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[Beardy]

I wouldn’t bother trying to remove the tiles, just cut the plasterboard below the bench line and above the overhead cupboard line and replace it with new wet area plasterboard

[ian]

I wouldn’t bother trying to remove the tiles, just cut the plasterboard below the bench line and above the overhead cupboard line and replace it with new wet area plasterboard
:whs:

[rob streeper]

You can also use concrete panels to replace the plasterboard behind the backsplash tiles, less flex. If this was mine I'd re-route the electrical cables through the wall studs and protect them with nailguards as well. Set any outlet boxes in the backsplash to stand about 10 mm proud of the face of the substrate so that they end flush with the face of the new backsplash. Now is also the time to install an over-range vent duct if your plan includes one. Follow the instructions of your new flooring to the letter, some types, particularly vinyl planks, can't be laid under cabinets. In addition, some types of flooring require the surface on which they're laid to be very flat and if your slab is not flat you'll have problems.

[ian]

If this was mine I'd re-route the electrical cables through the wall studs and protect them with nailguards as well.
Now is also the time to install an over-range vent duct if your plan includes one.
:whs:



also
now would be a good time to mark the location of the wall studs.

[Grumpy John]

You can also use concrete panels to replace the plasterboard behind the backsplash tiles, less flex. If this was mine I'd re-route the electrical cables through the wall studs and protect them with nailguards as well. Set any outlet boxes in the backsplash to stand about 10 mm proud of the face of the substrate so that they end flush with the face of the new backsplash. Now is also the time to install an over-range vent duct if your plan includes one. Follow the instructions of your new flooring to the letter, some types, particularly vinyl planks, can't be laid under cabinets. In addition, some types of flooring require the surface on which they're laid to be very flat and if your slab is not flat you'll have problems.

Thanks for the tips Rob. I'll look into the possibility of using a cement sheet, however I'll probably just use plasterboard as it's easier to work with. As for the vinyl tiles I will be tiling up to the cabinets, not under them. I will be removing any planks which will be under the cabinets.

[Grumpy John]

:whs:



also
now would be a good time to mark the location of the wall studs.

Already had this in mind Ian :).

[rob streeper]

These are a big help with plasterboard patches. Insta-Back (https://www.prest-on.com/products/insta-back)

[Grumpy John]

Day 2.
From what I'm seeing now that the plaster has been removed I'm guessing that these are not the original cupboards, or appliances. Eighteen months ago when I replaced the wall oven and cooktop I replaced like for like (Electric oven, gas cooktop), but seeing the current wiring it looks like the original setup was quite different.

Gotta love tradies, obviously too far to walk to the rubbish bin.
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I think that this may have been for the original oven.
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I'm guessing that this GPO was not part of the original kitchen. I din't like the way that the wiring was done either. Is it even legal?
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Wiring for the GPO that feeds the microwave. Once again, I doubt that this is legal.
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Feed to the existing wall oven.
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I'm guessing that there were no wall cupboards in the original kitchen.
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[rob streeper]

Looks like your house was done up by some San Antonio contractors!

You might want to look behind your bathroom walls as well.

[Grumpy John]

Looks like your house was done up by some San Antonio contractors!

You might want to look behind your bathroom walls as well.

I'm guessing that's not a good thing.

Funny you should mention it, the wall you're seeing is one of the bathroom walls. Bathroom reno is somewhere in the distant future.

[ian]

This looks like there was a doorway here sometime in the past.

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more importantly, from what you write, I'm guessing you are something like the 10th or 11th owner of the property.

Given your age, you are unlikely to be a victim of one of the asbestos diseases -- you more than likely will be dead before the dust disease gets you -- but your kids and grand kiddies could be at risk.

How sure are you that the property has never been sheeted in asbestos? That none of the dust you are discovering is not contaminated with asbestos? Perhaps ban them from the house till after the reno work is completed. Once you have fully cleaned up, including all the dust residual risk should be minimal.

[rob streeper]

Just noticed what looks like two layers of drywall in your first pic, am I seeing things?
At least from what you've shown it doesn't look like it's been wet.

[rob streeper]

BTW, what's this?
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The beginnings of a fusion reactor?

[Grumpy John]

Just noticed what looks like two layers of drywall in your first pic, am I seeing things?
At least from what you've shown it doesn't look like it's been wet.

Funny how the terminology differs between the two countries. We call it plaster, or plasterboard. Sometimes referred to as Gryrock, brand name.
No, one layer only, not sure which pic you are referring to.
Yes everything looks dry, so far. We did have issues in the shower recess at one time, when the bottom cupboards come out I will have a better idea if there is any water damage.
So far, apart from the dodgy wiring things have been going pretty smoothly, this scares me just a tad, because at some point the proverbial is going to hit the fan.

[Grumpy John]

BTW, what's this?
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The beginnings of a fusion reactor?

That's the backside of the DPP in the ensuite.

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This looks like there was a doorway here sometime in the past.

more importantly, from what you write, I'm guessing you are something like the 10th or 11th owner of the property.

Given your age, you are unlikely to be a victim of one of the asbestos diseases -- you more than likely will be dead before the dust disease gets you -- but your kids and grand kiddies could be at risk.

How sure are you that the property has never been sheeted in asbestos? That none of the dust you are discovering is not contaminated with asbestos? Perhaps ban them from the house till after the reno work is completed. Once you have fully cleaned up, including all the dust residual risk should be minimal.

No doorway Ian.

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Wrong, only the second owner.

House built in 1997, I doubt very much that there is any asbestos in the walls. Thanks for your concern though.

[DJ’s Timber]

Just noticed what looks like two layers of drywall in your first pic, am I seeing things?
At least from what you've shown it doesn't look like it's been wet.



No one layer only, not sure which pic you are referring

Me thinks he is seeing the tile and gyprock as two layers.

[Grumpy John]

I'm having a day off the tools today, but I would like to get some feedback on whether to use tiles for the splashback, or use an acrylic splashback. I'm sure there are pros and cons for both materials and I'm interested in seeing your thoughts. Glass is not an option, mainly because of cost.

[rob streeper]

I did one once with clear glass subway tiles, about 2.75" X 5". On white mastic with zero grout lines. I filled the gaps with clear silicone and cleaned off the excess silicone with ethanol as I moved along. I made floating shelves from cabinet ply and hard maple colored with gray green tinted lacquer installed with the tops about 9" under the bottom of the upper cabinets. Four years now and holding steady.

[Grumpy John]

Thanks for the feedback Rob. If I do settle on tiles I would like to use the largest tiles practical, less grouting and less cutting, IMHO.

[rob streeper]

Don't discount subway style tiles, they go up really fast and compared to bigger there may be less cutting. The area in your pic's shouldn't take more than an afternoon. https://www.lowes.com/pd/American-Olean-Color-Appeal-32-Pack-Moonlight-3-in-x-6-in-Unglazed-Glass-Subway-Wall-Tile/1002268860?cm_mmc=shp-_-c-_-prd-_-flr-_-google-_-pla-_-230-_-soswalltile-_-1002268860-_-0&placeholder=null&gclid=CjwKCAjwoc_8BRAcEiwAzJevtbwNYzEdVHVJTNmwtf6Cmfo9XMkUmuKdLwGXeCbdMdRu2j3wGwm4hxoClGMQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

[Grumpy John]

The project manager (SWMBO) would prefer a larger tile, her reasoning is that there would be less grout to clean. Who am I to argue :rolleyes:.

[Beardy]

Never used acrylic only glass or tiles or stone , would the acrylic scratch or mark up easily?

I think the decision is based on visual preference and what is in keeping with the style you are running with

[Grumpy John]

Never used acrylic only glass or tiles or stone , would the acrylic scratch or mark up easily?

I think the decision is based on visual preference and what is in keeping with the style you are running with

From the Bunnies website:



More sizes and colours available through Special Orders

Contemporary high gloss finish
Scratch resistant and repairable
Custom colours available

A Bellessi Splashback is the new way to add colour, functionality and durability to your home. It is perfect for use in kitchens, bathrooms and laundries or virtually on any vertical surface. Bellessi adds colour for life! It's lightweight, cost effective, easy to cut to size and install on site. Bellessi is an Australian made modified polymer panel with an extremely high gloss finish. Bellessi will transform your kitchen, bathroom or living areas into a vibrant modern environment. It is 50% lighter and 25 times more impact resistant than glass.



I couldn't agree more Beardy, that's why the splashback, whatever material we (I mean SWMBO) choose, will be the last thing done on the reno.

[ian]

The project manager (SWMBO) would prefer a larger tile, her reasoning is that there would be less grout to clean. Who am I to argue :rolleyes:
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John

Your kitchen has some very strong horizontal lines, emphasised by the coloured horizontal stripe.

Me. I'd try for two rows of tiles below the stripe and one above -- but that infers you can get glazed tiles of the required size.
I wouldn't use polished stone as it's, IMO, too hard to keep clean. SWMBO is forever spraying the stone bench tops here with a surface cleaner.

IMO, the stripe really lifts the look of your original kitchen.

[Bernmc]

We've got acrylic (not fitted by me - here when we turned up). It's great. I don't think I'd go back to tiles given the choice. Looks good, easy to clean, and it's hard wearing (no scratches on ours)

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Carries on around the other side of the window and stops the coffee machine splattering the walls, but you get the idea

[Grumpy John]

Day 3.
Old kitchen all gone and ready to start installing the new kitchen tomorrow.
Found out today that because I have a gas cooktop only glass or tiles are permitted for use as splashback material.

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Wiring has been rerouted through the studs, much better.
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[Grumpy John]

We've got acrylic (not fitted by me - here when we turned up). It's great. I don't think I'd go back to tiles given the choice. Looks good, easy to clean, and it's hard wearing (no scratches on ours)

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Carries on around the other side of the window and stops the coffee machine splattering the walls, but you get the idea

Interesting to see you have a gas cooktop, I have been told that you can't use acrylic splashbacks behind a gas cooktop.


Splashbacks and gas

Most installation requirements relating to splashbacks have to do with gas. When you consider that many splashbacks will be built behind ovens and other cooking implements, this is an important factor so you don’t burst a gas pipe or blow yourself up.
Combustible splashbacks installed behind open-flame gas cooktops are carefully regulated in order to prevent them from catching or spreading fire. These regulations are specifically contained within the requiremens for the installation of gas appliances. Combustible materials generally include things like acrylic splashbacks, timber splashbacks and similarly susceptible materials. Many builders and designers believe (understandably) that glass and stainless steel are non-combustible materials; however both conduct heat fairly well, and if they're too close to a gas burner they can easily transfer heat to the unprotected substrate material or timber framing behind them - which as you can imagine may easily end in disaster. A clearance between the nearest gas burner to any combustible splashback of 200mm or more means the installation will be fine. Any less than 200mm and you will need your builder to do a little bit of work to make it safe. If you have a stainless steel or glass splashback, you'll need to install a fire resistant board up to the same distance (200mm from the nearest gas burner) behind the glass or stainless steel splashback that complies with the requirements of AS 5601/AG 601 Gas Installations, Appendix C substrate. There are exceptions to this rule - if clear documentation can be supplied that demonstrates that the fixing method will ensure that the temperature of the combustible surface won't exceed 65º Celsius above ambient temperature during normal operation, then a fire resistant board isn't necessary.

[ian]

Splashbacks and gas

Most installation requirements relating to splashbacks have to do with gas. When you consider that many splashbacks will be built behind ovens and other cooking implements, this is an important factor so you don’t burst a gas pipe or blow yourself up.
Combustible splashbacks installed behind open-flame gas cooktops are carefully regulated in order to prevent them from catching or spreading fire. These regulations are specifically contained within the requiremens for the installation of gas appliances. Combustible materials generally include things like acrylic splashbacks, timber splashbacks and similarly susceptible materials. Many builders and designers believe (understandably) that glass and stainless steel are non-combustible materials; however both conduct heat fairly well, and if they're too close to a gas burner they can easily transfer heat to the unprotected substrate material or timber framing behind them - which as you can imagine may easily end in disaster. A clearance between the nearest gas burner to any combustible splashback of 200mm or more means the installation will be fine. Any less than 200mm and you will need your builder to do a little bit of work to make it safe. If you have a stainless steel or glass splashback, you'll need to install a fire resistant board up to the same distance (200mm from the nearest gas burner) behind the glass or stainless steel splashback that complies with the requirements of AS 5601/AG 601 Gas Installations, Appendix C substrate. There are exceptions to this rule - if clear documentation can be supplied that demonstrates that the fixing method will ensure that the temperature of the combustible surface won't exceed 65º Celsius above ambient temperature during normal operation, then a fire resistant board isn't necessary.so the issue is about achieving 200 mm clearance from the closest gas burner. Perhaps Bernmc has the required 200 mm clearance, meaning his "potentially" combustible splash back is OK?

[ian]

Day 3.
Old kitchen all gone and ready to start installing the new kitchen tomorrow.

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Wiring has been rerouted through the studs, much better.
two, possibly three, potential "gotcha" issues I can see.

1. does the new cabinetry exactly match the colour of the pelmet you have left in the ceiling? Me thinks it's unlikely.

2. do the new overhead cupboards exactly meet with the pelmet? IMO this is critical to the amount of work required on the ceiling.

3. when do you intend repairing / re-sheeting the walls. Kitchens I've seen installed were into spaces where the walls were fully intact. Fixing the walls will require disconnecting the power to the ensuite.

[rob streeper]

Another thought for this stage: Do you want more, relocated or different lumieres or electrical outlets? Under cabinet lights?

[riverbuilder]

One thing I always do at this stage John is replace all the plasterboard, do all the patching, it’s easier now rather than bending over the cabinets. And go around afterwards and seal up everywhere with no more gaps. This gives the cockroaches and other critters less places to come through the walls and in under and inside the cabinets. Pay particular attention to holes through the bottom plate, where wires or gas lines come through, this is a common spot for pest egress.

[Bernmc]

Interesting to see you have a gas cooktop, I have been told that you can't use acrylic splashbacks behind a gas cooktop.

Aint nuttin' compliant about this house. Built, reno'd and re-reno'd since the sixties, there's a hodgepodge of construction and standards. And non-standards.

[Grumpy John]

two, possibly three, potential "gotcha" issues I can see.

1. does the new cabinetry exactly match the colour of the pelmet you have left in the ceiling? Me thinks it's unlikely.

2. do the new overhead cupboards exactly meet with the pelmet? IMO this is critical to the amount of work required on the ceiling.

3. when do you intend repairing / re-sheeting the walls. Kitchens I've seen installed were into spaces where the walls were fully intact. Fixing the walls will require disconnecting the power to the ensuite.

1. & 2. The pelmet and cornice work is going to be replaced.
3. Not sure what you mean by having to disconnect power to the ensuite. The power will be isolated at the mains while electrical work is being carried out.


Another thought for this stage: Do you want more, relocated or different lumieres or electrical outlets? Under cabinet lights?

There are sufficient power outlets already installed. Lighting is all good.


One thing I always do at this stage John is replace all the plasterboard, do all the patching, it’s easier now rather than bending over the cabinets. And go around afterwards and seal up everywhere with no more gaps. This gives the cockroaches and other critters less places to come through the walls and in under and inside the cabinets. Pay particular attention to holes through the bottom plate, where wires or gas lines come through, this is a common spot for pest egress.

I was going to plaster the walls after the cabinets were installed, but you have given me food for thought. I'll reassess my plan of attack after the kitchen arrives this morning.

[Grumpy John]

Thank you all for the input so far, it has been greatly appreciated.
In past kitchen reno's I have always struggled with connecting the sink to the waste pipe. For some reason there never seems to be exactly the right combo of PVC fittings available. This time I think that I will purchase the fittings and locate the sink to suit. I can always buy a couple of different combo's and return what I don't use.

I believe that I will have to cut off the waste pipe below the sleeve to facilitate fitting the cupboard, then fit another sleeve and extend the waste pipe again.
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[ian]

3. Not sure what you mean by having to disconnect power to the ensuite. The power will be isolated at the mains while electrical work is being carried out.
isolating the power at the mains is what I meant


I was going to plaster the walls after the cabinets were installed, but you have given me food for thought. I'll reassess my plan of attack after the kitchen arrives this morning.
RB is on the money.
Do the plaster work before the cabinets are installed, while access is easy.

[Grumpy John]

One thing I always do at this stage John is replace all the plasterboard, do all the patching, it’s easier now rather than bending over the cabinets. And go around afterwards and seal up everywhere with no more gaps. This gives the cockroaches and other critters less places to come through the walls and in under and inside the cabinets. Pay particular attention to holes through the bottom plate, where wires or gas lines come through, this is a common spot for pest egress.

Call me paranoid/over cautious, but I just spent a small fortune getting other dodgy wiring that was done by the previous owner fixed. If we were ever to have a fire in the house the insurance company would use any non compliant issues to reject a claim, I don't want to give them any ammo.

[riverbuilder]

Call me paranoid/over cautious, but I just spent a small fortune getting other dodgy wiring that was done by the previous owner fixed. If we were ever to have a fire in the house the insurance company would use any non compliant issues to reject a claim, I don't want to give them any ammo.
I fail to see how closing pest entry points will give your insurance company any reason to reject a claim. If anything it’s lessening the likelihood of rodents getting in and chewing the cables, a major cause of electrical problems and cause of fires. Do what you like.

[Grumpy John]

I fail to see how closing pest entry points will give your insurance company any reason to reject a claim. If anything it’s lessening the likelihood of rodents getting in and chewing the cables, a major cause of electrical problems and cause of fires. Do what you like.

Sorry RB, I quoted the wrong post.

I meant to quote this one

Aint nuttin' compliant about this house. Built, reno'd and re-reno'd since the sixties, there's a hodgepodge of construction and standards. And non-standards.

[Beardy]

Further to what RB said, apart from it being easier to do the plasterboard work now, it is also ideal and less work to have the sheet joins behind the carcasses rather than on the tiled area.
With your waste, cut it below carcass height and add new section of pipe at fit off stage, that is typical practice.
Also you might consider using the clear rather than blue or green plumbers solvent glue as it looks neater if exposed

[riverbuilder]

I fail to see how closing pest entry points will give your insurance company any reason to reject a claim. If anything it’s lessening the likelihood of rodents getting in and chewing the cables, a major cause of electrical problems and cause of fires. Do what you like.


Further to what RB said, apart from it being easier to do the plasterboard work now, it is also ideal and less work to have the sheet joins behind the carcasses rather than on the tiled area.
With your waste, cut it below carcass height and add new section of pipe at fit off stage, that is typical practice.
Also you might consider using the clear rather than blue or green plumbers solvent glue as it looks neater if exposed
This is correct, a lot of times I’ve found it easier and quicker to remove all the old plasterboard, clean and straighten the studs, let the electrician do his thing, and then throw two new full size sheets up, one horizontal joint and two internal corners, done and sealed.

with regard to the waste pipe, that is the plumbers problem to solve.

[Grumpy John]

The kitchen turned up late this arvo. A quick setup to check where everything goes. Also decided to remove pelmet and cornice.

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[rob streeper]

Don't forget nail guards. Better safe than sorry.

[Grumpy John]

I've been treading water (pun intended) for the last couple of days waiting on a plumber to come over and move the water outlets over to the right. Because the sink and dishwasher are going to be ~300mm to the right the water outlets are in the wrong position.
Also doing a dry run for the waste outlet using some scrap pieces of 50mm PVC.

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[Beardy]

Grumpy if you have the height you can put a 90 bend at slab level and turn the waste pipe up closer to the sink. I like to try and bring the pipe up behind the sink waste so the the trap sits front to back more than side to side so it takes up less room in the cupboard shelf

[Grumpy John]

Grumpy if you have the height you can put a 90 bend at slab level and turn the waste pipe up closer to the sink. I like to try and bring the pipe up behind the sink waste so the the trap sits front to back more than side to side so it takes up less room in the cupboard shelf

Thanks for the suggestion Beardy. I just asked the plumber (he's here now) and he said to put in a 90 deg bend and run the pipe under the kicker. The reason I was going to use the 2 45's was to allow the waste water to escape with less restriction.

Always better to get these things sorted before the glue goes on :D.

[ian]

I've been treading water (pun intended) for the last couple of days waiting on a plumber to come over and move the water outlets over to the right. Because the sink and dishwasher are going to be ~300mm to the right the water outlets are in the wrong position.
Also doing a dry run for the waste outlet using some scrap pieces of 50mm PVC.

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I know I'm too late because the plumber has likely been and gone, but your plumbing is plastic pipe.
Why did you decide against using stainless steel armoured flexible connections to connect to the new location for the sink and dishwasher?

[riverbuilder]

I know I'm too late because the plumber has likely been and gone, but your plumbing is plastic pipe.
Why did you decide against using stainless steel armoured flexible connections to connect to the new location for the sink and dishwasher?
Over here down under we use those to connect from the stop cock valve to the appliance, or the tap assembly, they’re not allowed to be used inside the wall.

[ian]

I know one should never "assume" but ...
It looks to me as though the existing pipe terminations are the kitchen side of the gyprock, so fitting a stop cock and then using the armoured pipe to the tap / appliance would all be allowed.

or do I have it the wrong way first ??

[Grumpy John]

The new plumbing looks so much neater than the original. No need for a separate hot water inlet for the dishwasher.

These images should show things a bit more clearly Ian.
483745

483746

Wall oven cabinet fully fitted and oven connected. I still need to fit a back to the microwave section. The other cabinets are not fitted yet, just checking that things are square and good to secure. The wide cabinet is sitting out from the wall as I still have to drill a hole in the back to pass the gas line through.
483747

[riverbuilder]

cant help but notice you've not lined the wall behind the sink cupboard with plasterboard, all the bugs in the district will come for a party,and with penetrations through the cabinet for plumbing,they have access to the inside. Yes I realise "Nobody will ever see it", it's just not good building practice.

[DJ’s Timber]

cant help but notice you've not lined the wall behind the sink cupboard with plasterboard, all the bugs in the district will come for a party,and with penetrations through the cabinet for plumbing,they have access to the inside. Yes I realise "Nobody will ever see it", it's just not good building practice.



The other cabinets are not fitted yet, just checking that things are square and good to secure.

...

[Grumpy John]

Final dry fitting of the base cabinets, just to make sure everything fits and the benchtops come together before everything gets screwed down.

483865

483866

483867






cant help but notice you've not lined the wall behind the sink cupboard with plasterboard, all the bugs in the district will come for a party,and with penetrations through the cabinet for plumbing,they have access to the inside. Yes I realise "Nobody will ever see it", it's just not good building practice.

I have plastered behind the sink, those images were just for ians benefit.

[DJ’s Timber]

Looking good John :2tsup:

The boss will be happy with that

[Grumpy John]

I'm tossing up as to whether or not to tile the wall adjacent to the breakfast bar. There were tiles there before, I just don't know if their necessary or not.
Thoughts please.

[ian]

I have plastered behind the sink, those images were just for ians benefit.
:2tsup:

[DJ’s Timber]

I'm tossing up as to whether or not to tile the wall adjacent to the breakfast bar. There were tiles there before, I just don't know if their necessary or not.
Thoughts please.

You talking about this bit John?

483874

I would, tiles cover the edge of the bench and seal it as well.

I don’t think it would look quite right without the tiles as well.

[Beardy]

I am feeling tiles there too

[Grumpy John]

You talking about this bit John?

483874

I would, tiles cover the edge of the bench and seal it as well.

I don’t think it would look quite right without the tiles as well.

Yes DJ, that's the area I'm talking about.


I am feeling tiles there too


Thanks for the feedback gentlemen, I'll take it under advisement. SWMBO will have the final say you undestand :D.

[Beardy]

Smart man, I would put the tiles on back to front if that is what she wants :D

[DJ’s Timber]

SWMBO will have the final say you undestand :D.

I’ve never had this problem fortunately :q :q :U

[Grumpy John]

I'm in the process of fitting the overhead cupboards, just waiting on the rangehood to arrive so I can finish it off.

484286

[ian]

I'm in the process of fitting the overhead cupboards

484286
John
Have you checked that the doors -- which aren't in line BTW -- do open fully?

[Grumpy John]

Yes Ian, the doors open fully. Probably the last thing that I'll do is go around and give all the doors and drawers a final adjustment.