WA v Kiwi drivers.

[Boringgeoff]

Here in Western Australia we are constantly hearing that we are the worlds worst drivers. We recently had to go to New Zealand and after picking up a hire car at Auckland airport headed South down the motorway. At that time of the morning traffic heading into the city is pretty heavy but the run South was quite easy. There are extensive road works being carried out on State Highway 1 and we soon entered a 70 km zone so I slowed down, well, the cars in front of me started disappearing in the distance and the traffic started banking up behind me, I sped up to 80. I thought that exceeding the limit by 10 km was all I was prepared to do and I can tell you that at that speed we were still holding the traffic up. Eventually, keeping up with the flow the speed restriction signs may as well have not existed.
I've not driven extensively in NZ for nearly 50 years and having spent most of my life in the Pilbara, the hilly, windy road out to Kawhia in NZ is pretty scary. In WA to drive my truck from Karratha to Paraburdoo, a distance of 540 km, I'd set the cruise control on 100 and disengage/reengage it probably only 3 or 4 times, arriving after 5 1/2 hours.
Whew, the drive to Kawhia as a tourist trying to look at the scenery and not make the navigator car sick is nerve racking. Constantly there are cars and trucks riding your rear bumper, you throw your car off the road into any convenient driveway, runoff etc they fly past with a cheerful wave and a beep and disappear round the corner. Vehicles coming from the opposite direction get back on their side of the road just in the nick of time. Lucky we brought plenty of spare undies with us, eh bro.
But we survived, got the hire car back undamaged and are glad to be back home in the state of the worlds worst drivers, good old WA.
Cheers,
Geoff

[BobL]

During our honeymoon on NZ in the 1970's we hired one of those Holden one ton utes with a top heavy camper on the back.
SWMBO immediately got carsick and spent most of the time laying down on the front bench seat.

On the South Island we were well down the west cost looking for a way to get to Queenstown using what looked like an out of date map so we stopped and asked some locals and they directed us onto a road which turned into a gravel road and then not much more than a goat track to cross the hills (err . . . . mountains). As we climbed higher and then over the other side I was struck by the numbers of wrecked vehicles that looked like they had fallen off the goat track. We realised this was serious and so took it very slowly but were every now and then passed by battered vehicles who did not seem to be phased by going off the track (up or down hill or even around corners) to pass us.

Eventually we made it over the mountains and stopped at the first petrol staton and as usual they asked us where we were from etc. I then asked about that road (er track) without any indication that is where we had just been and the bloke said "Don't go that way, its too bloody dangerous mate, I always having to go up there to rescue vehicles"

[Boringgeoff]

The reason we were there was because my sister has passed away from cancer. She used to drive pretty fast and I was always pretty nervous as a passenger with her. The reason? In about 1975 my wife and I went on a camping trip with her in her car down the lower part of the South Island. Crossing the Cardrona Ranges from Wanaka to Queenstown on the downhill run in third gear she would stand on the anchors to slow down on the corners until the engine was running at less than idle speed. Once round the corner we'd be off like a shot until the next corner then back on the anchors. I'd just about pushed the passengers floor out with my feet. When we pulled up at the bottom of the hill the brakes were smoking.
On the drive out the Shotover River to Skippers Canyon after stopping for a photo opportunity I'd had enough and got behind the wheel, much to her indignation, I said to her "I drive or I'm walking". Subsequently whenever we drove anywhere with her, those experiences were in the back of my mind.

[tonzeyd]

My experience with NZ driving was two weeks in the south island whilst on honeymoon. Can honestly say if you remove the people aspect I'd prefer driving in Aus anyday, steep drops off hills, windy roads that are constantly wet even in winter doesn't inspire confidence.

On the other hand once you include the incompetence of large proportions of Perth drivers and i'll chose the hilly countryside of NZ any day most probably because there isn't that many drivers on the roads in NZ's south to begin with.

The issue i find with Aussie drivers is they can be at times on the selfish side, so merging for example is a skill that according to a recent RAC survey is a skill many motorists lack or adhering to simple road rules such as a solid white line, have been nearly killed on a number of occasions because of this, probably also doesn't help being on two wheels.

[nyamo_iaint]

Crossing the Cardrona Ranges from Wanaka to Queenstown on the downhill run in third gear she would stand on the anchors to slow down on the corners until the engine was running at less than idle speed. Once round the corner we'd be off like a shot until the next corner then back on the anchors. I'd just about pushed the passengers floor out with my feet. When we pulled up at the bottom of the hill the brakes were smoking.
That's the Crown Pass road? I came down that on my bike one time. I can quite imagine it happening - never been much of a fan of switchbacks - and we were carrying extra weight too. Although I think the temperature of my wheel rims after coming down the road from Mangrove Mountain/Central Mangrove worried me more.

I was once driven around a narrow dark twisty road at seemingly high speed with a dodgy seat belt while in Japan. That was scary.


On the other hand once you include the incompetence of large proportions of Perth drivers and i'll chose the hilly countryside of NZ any day most probably because there isn't that many drivers on the roads in NZ's south to begin with.
I found that too. Even along the main highways out of Christchurch the traffic was light enough that I never felt all that unsafe, except from the buses. Cars and trucks gave us plenty of spaces, but the buses...

Iain

[rrich]

An amusing thread that only confirms my own experiences.

Los Angeles metro area:
Where else can you drive with about 2 car lengths between cars at 80 MPH (129 KPH)?
Going into down town Los Angeles in the morning, a lot of give and take.
Going into Orange County in the morning, considerably less give and take.

On the road to Las Vegas (I-15) SWMBO says, "Traffic is moving along." GPS says 88 MPH (142 KPH).

The beltway around Washington D.C., I-495 and 4 lanes wide. In the fast lane, 85 MPH seems to be the norm while in the slow lane 45 MPH seems to be the norm. Unh, wait! Three miles down the road the norm is 45 MPH in the fast lane and 85 MPH in the slow lane. (72 KPH and 138 KPH) I refuse to drive on the beltway unless there is no alternative.

In Washington D.C. traffic
Rent a car, hold the folded rental car map for all to see, use turn signals and even taxi drivers will get out of your way.

Phoenix, Arizona
Mostly normal driving by the full time residents. Between mid November to mid April, when the light turns green for you, look both ways before entering the intersection, it's "Snow Bird" season.

Boston
Remember, Boston drivers originated the concept of triple parking. A tour company had a sign, "Avoid the obnoxious driving habits of the locals and ride our tour busses." Intimidation is a way of life when approaching a 'Rotary'.

Beware of the blinking green light. Even the state troopers don't know what it "really" means. I actually asked one what it means. He responded with, "Where did you see a blinking green?" My answer was, "Route 2 in Boston." His response was "Boston is a unique entity."

New York City
A taxi driver summed it up quite correctly, (Trying to be PC) "Most drivers are rectal orifices but they don't know it." It has been about 50 years since I drove in the city and if I do it again it will be too soon.

Pittsburgh
Probably the most polite drivers ever. Most drivers will allow a cross traffic turn in front of them as the light turns green.

Drivers in General
Almost everywhere there are only 4 types of drivers, "Users", "Keepers", "Takers" and "Star gazers".
In heavy traffic, a User will use every bit of space between vehicles, while a Keeper will keep those 5 or whatever number of car lengths they were taught. A Taker is the vehicle that is zipping in and out of lanes, cutting people off and hard breaking to prevent a crash after taking the space. You can follow a star gazer for many Ks, and still not realize what they are aiming at.

One further bit of wisdom when driving in traffic.
The trick to making time when driving is "Drive 25 MPH when everyone else is only going 15 MPH."

[AlexS]

Rrich, I drove from Albuquerque to LA earlier this year. I was most worried about driving into LA, but decided I'd just drive like the rest of the Angelinos. I found that even though the traffic was as you described, I had no trouble getting into the correct lanes, and once I was over my fear of being shunted, all worked well.
Your description of Las Vegas matches my experience, as does the Washington beltway, which I saw as a passenger with my daughter.

[BobL]

I was once driven around a narrow dark twisty road at seemingly high speed with a dodgy seat belt while in Japan. That was scary.


My best Japanese war story is when I went to a conference there which was in a small mountainside town on the north coast of Honshu. It was snowing and cold reaching -15ºC or so at night. The day after the conference finished a couple of the Japanese conference attendees I knew said they were hiring a car and going for a drive and did I want to go and as I was free I said yes.

The day was clear and sunny and the snow had been swept off the road by lots of snow ploughs and was melting so off went - all good.

After driving sedately for a couple of hours one of the Japanese blokes looking at a map says "hey, we're not that far from the place where a hermit/guru lives in a no walled hut (he sits in the same position for hours each day praying, hasn't cut his hair for decades and wears no clothes!) up the side of mountain - you can drive to within 50 m of his hut. I could see no reason to do this but I just went with the flow and off we went. We took a narrow side road and headed up the mountain - lots of switchbacks - the snow was piled 1+m deep on the side of the road, and while it had had not cleared off this road there were plenty of fresh tyre tracks so we followed these for a while until we came to a place were numerous small streams of melt water crossing the road and as these had frozen they turned the road into a skating rink .

The driver said I'm not going to drive the car on that but we're not that far so we could walk the rest of the way. After he parked the car we set off - there was a stiff wind blowing and it was cold and we were not really dressed to be outside. After we crossed the first "rink" we had to cross 2 more of these ice patches and I fell over several times till I made myself a walking stick. We rounded the last switchback and there was a car park with about half a dozen cars there and a small group of people looking upwards to what looked to me like a pile of sticks.

The hut was not 50m from the road , more like 250m, the Guru was on a break and had apparently been on a break for the last hour. As I said none of use were wearing the clothes needed to be outside an as it had started snowing we headed back down. Now going back down over the ice rinks was way worse than going up and we all fell over many times and it was safer to walk in the snow and slush on the up mountain side of the road. After we crossed the first rink our shoes and lower half of our daks were completely saturated and a large Nissan sedan heading downwards pulled up and the driver asked us if we would like a lift down and being frozen and wet through we jumped in. The driver took off at an alarming rate jabbering away in Japanese with my colleagues and and only slowed down a little just before driving onto an ice patch and promptly slid the car along the ice. My life flashed before my eyes but the driver was good at steering into the skid and gained enough traction to to stop the car going over the side of the mountain but somehow managed to steer the car into the bank of snow on the up-mountain side of the road. While that happened the driver was totally non-plussed - he had a big smile on his face and said "Solly but no plobrem"!

The driver then asked the Japanese bloke in the front passengers seat to get into the boot to add some weight to the back of the vehicle - it was that point I realised the tyres had no snow chains. The other blokes and I had to stand in the slush and try and push the car out of the snow bank. The driver slowly backed the car out of the bank and off we went again. This time the driver paid a bit more attention and drove a bit slower but the same thing happened one more time before we made it across the next two rinks.

By that time I was shaking, knackered, wet and very cold, and we headed back for the first bar for refreshments. It took quite a few shots of sake to calm my nerves,

[Grumpy John]

The beltway around Washington D.C., I-495 and 4 lanes wide. In the fast lane, 85 MPH seems to be the norm while in the slow lane 45 MPH seems to be the norm. Unh, wait! Three miles down the road the norm is 45 MPH in the fast lane and 85 MPH in the slow lane. (72 KPH and 138 KPH) I refuse to drive on the beltway unless there is no alternative.


I've always wondered "what the hell is a beltway"? For that matter, what is a Parkway. Where do you guys come up with these names? :D:D:D

[BobL]

I've always wondered "what the hell is a beltway"? For that matter, what is a Parkway. Where do you guys come up with these names? :D:D:D

A belt way is where you get stuck in traffic for so long you lose a belt size by the time you get out of the car.
A park way is because the cars are stopped for most of the time.

[nyamo_iaint]

The driver then asked the Japanese bloke in the front passengers seat to get into the boot to add some weight to the back of the vehicle - it was that point I realised the tyres had no snow chains. The other blokes and I had to stand in the slush and try and push the car out of the snow bank. The driver slowly backed the car out of the bank and off we went again. This time the driver paid a bit more attention and drove a bit slower but the same thing happened one more time before we made it across the next two rinks.

By that time I was shaking, knackered, wet and very cold, and we headed back for the first bar for refreshments. It took quite a few shots of sake to calm my nerves,

Nice. Luckily even when I was driving up there once we never ended up with that kind of event.

The few times we were in snowy regions of Japan we had special snow tires, but I doubt that they could deal with a snowbank. The normal roads weren't so bad provided we had visibility - hard packed, but not icy now. The worst part (or so I'm told, because I wasn't driving) was the tunnel entrances and exits on the expressway. At the transition point from hard packed snow to bare bitumen you could get refrozen melt water, and with it all the risks black ice usually brings. Luckily the expressways are fairly straight, the tunnel entrances are pretty obvious, and the transition points were not so long.

Iain

[rrich]

OMG! This is going back to when I was a kid in Brooklyn. About 1950.

New York City built a multi lane, stop light free road around mostly Brooklyn and Queens. They named it "The Belt Parkway". I think that many other places picked up the "Belt" part of the name.

I almost forgot, Boston! If a local gives you driving directions and says to take Route 128, they really mean I-95. The Route 128, a.k.a. Electronics Highway, was one of the Boston area's first multilane highways. Route was later renamed I-95 to get more funds from the Federal government. The locals will still refer to the road as 128. IIRC - At the interchange there is one small (½ M square) sign that identifies the road as 128.

[Twisted Tenon]

Gotta say that IMHO Sydney drivers are the worst I've come across followed closely by drivers from my neck of the woods. I was over in Adelaide a few years ago and was pleasantly surprised at how drivers there were'nt precious about letting people caught behind bus' out. Spent a month in NZ in 07 and was also pleasantly surprised at how laid back the Bro's were. Hardley heard a horn beeped in anger the whole time.

TT

[AlexS]

When I lived in Adelaide 40 years ago, I was amazed at how long the locals took to take off when the lights turned green, and how they kept on going through after the lights turned red. Try that in Sydney and they'd have everyone blasting their horns on the green, and would be T-boned on the red.

[Boringgeoff]

In the mid 80's on the way back to WA from NZ we planned to hire a car at Sydney and drive up to the Snowy's to visit friends. Before we left home someone told me "the Sydney drivers'll kill ya". Consequently by the time we picked the car up I was terrified. No worries the Sydney drivers were great, indicate, move, indicate, move they'll let you in, just don't dither. Tried that style of driving when we got back to Perth and got blasted with the horn, given the finger etc.
Coming into Adelaide once towing the caravan and Mrs BG looking at the road map. A truck pulls up beside us at the lights, voice comes over the UHF " where are you caravaners with the map heading" we told him, "that's where I'm going, follow me". (what sort of navigational aid do you use Geoff? "Usually SWAMBO with the map, but in Adelaide we use a Mack".)
Finally Cairns, whatever you do don't even think of pulling up when the lights turn orange or you'll be overrun.

[Bob38S]

Don't ever consider driving in Istanbul.

Painted lanes on the road only apply to the size of the vehicle, eg 2 trucks or busses, cars and taxis, you can easily go 3 across or if nothing is parked then 4.

Traffic lights, green means go, yellow means go faster, red means the bloke behind you has to stop.

Speeds, cornering is totally determined by what you think you can get away with, the locals obviously think that the first lap at Bathurst is for learners.

[Mr Brush]

When I lived in Adelaide 40 years ago, I was amazed at how long the locals took to take off when the lights turned green.

In Italy, everyone in the line who can actually see the traffic light hits the gas simultaneously the moment it turns green - and a whole row of cars moves off as one. Don't think it would work here......