Any tips to tell if this circular saw blade needs sharpening or replacing?

[barrysumpter]

Any tips to tell if this circular saw blade needs sharpening or replacing?

Are the photos clear enough?

A few days ago each one of the tips had a bulging tar/oil build up on every side.

Used a cheap Dremil take off to remove the tar from all sides as best I could.

Working on my technique to eliminate burn and blade gouging.
Seems a faster feed rate and another 2 to 3mm of off feed side relief on the fence.
And for whatever reason the Triton 2000 fence was loose and bowing away from the blade under pressure.

402278

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[elanjacobs]

I'd say it's due for a sharpen. In pics 1 & 2 you can see a bright line where the top meets the face which indicates that it's rounding over.

Out of curiosity, what are you cutting with it? Triple chip grind, high tooth count and what looks like 0 degree rake says to me that it's a non-ferrous metal blade...

[barrysumpter]

Wow!
So knowledgable!

Cutting mostly hard woods like Spotted gum and hard wood battens.
Some ply 6mm, 12mm, and 18mm.
And some pine 2x4s.

[elanjacobs]

I'm a qualified wood machinist and I read tooling catalogues for fun :rolleyes: (yes, really)

In a nutshell, you have the wrong blade for what you're doing; you should be running a timber blade which is ATB (alternate top bevel) with 10-15 degrees of positive rake and fewer teeth than the one you have. This will give you a better surface finish on endgrain, significantly reduce fuzzy edges on the back and bottom of crosscuts (which I'll bet you're experiencing now), be easier to push timber through and probably reduce the gum problem as it will be running cooler.

[barrysumpter]

Nice!
Thanks heaps.

Would you happen to have a hyperlink to a specific blade you would recommend?

[aldav]

Yep, it looks pretty shagged to me too! I wouldn't be cleaning carbide teeth with a Dremel. If you haven't got one of the specialist blade/bit cleaning solutions get some 'Simple Green' all purpose cleaner from the big green shed. It comes in a 32 fl.oz. spray bottle. Does a fantastic job of cleaning blades, works best when you immerse the blade just don't leave it in too long. Clean off with an old toothbrush.

[elanjacobs]

Can't help you there, the only blades I'm familiar with are industrial grade and they don't come small enough for a Triton (and if they did they'd cost $150+).
I'm sure it's been discussed here plenty, have a search through the forum and you should find something useful.

[aldav]

I just bought a new dedicated 10" crosscut blade for my tablesaw - this one https://www.amazon.com/D1080X-Diablo-10-Inch-80-tooth-PermaShield/dp/B00008WQ32. It's not one of the industrial ones, the carbide teeth aren't big enough to sharpen multiple times, but it does a fabulous job on crosscuts up to about 70mm and because it's not industrial I didn't have to pay an arm and a leg. Your Triton takes a 9-1/4" blade? If you have a look at CMT, Freud etc. catalogue I'm sure you'll find something suitable.

[barrysumpter]

I don't think the ATB exists for the 235mm.

how about this one:
Circular Saw Blade 235mm Irwin Marathon Weldtec Handheld Thin 9 1/4" 40t | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Circular-Saw-Blade-235mm-Irwin-Marathon-Weldtec-Handheld-Thin-9-1-4-40t/262733952487?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D39923%26meid%3Df268251287e94ebc87e23e07d0c16f0c%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D6%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D262601878884)

Better yet:
IRWIN PROFESSIONAL 235mm (9 1/4") 60T CIRCULAR SAW BLADE- WOOD CUTTING 95305 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/IRWIN-PROFESSIONAL-235mm-9-1-4-60T-CIRCULAR-SAW-BLADE-WOOD-CUTTING-95305/262733952375?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D39923%26meid%3D4ea2d259487445039be396895f3c0507%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D262652488536)

Not sure about the degrees of rake on either.

[barrysumpter]

I started with a green bottle of liquid used to remove grime before tapeing / sticking things to glass.

But it wouldn't clear the tar/oil buildup.

Went to soft sand paper on the dremil take off.
Wouldn't take it off either.

Moved to the copper colored wheel brush.
Took it off.
Was careful about holding it there too long.

Took forever.

[Chris Parks]

This video on blade cleaning was done by one of our fellow forum members (Mission Man?)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpzKrrG577U

[elanjacobs]

I don't think the ATB exists for the 235mm.

how about this one:
Circular Saw Blade 235mm Irwin Marathon Weldtec Handheld Thin 9 1/4" 40t | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Circular-Saw-Blade-235mm-Irwin-Marathon-Weldtec-Handheld-Thin-9-1-4-40t/262733952487?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D39923%26meid%3Df268251287e94ebc87e23e07d0c16f0c%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D6%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D262601878884)

Better yet:
IRWIN PROFESSIONAL 235mm (9 1/4") 60T CIRCULAR SAW BLADE- WOOD CUTTING 95305 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/IRWIN-PROFESSIONAL-235mm-9-1-4-60T-CIRCULAR-SAW-BLADE-WOOD-CUTTING-95305/262733952375?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D39923%26meid%3D4ea2d259487445039be396895f3c0507%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D262652488536)

Not sure about the degrees of rake on either.
Those are both ATB and they both say so and have an icon for it on the package. ATB is the single most common grind in the world, it exists in every size.

[barrysumpter]

I can see that.
Doesn't show the 10-15 degrees of rake or not.

[barrysumpter]

Thanks heaps for all the support gents.
Much appreciated.

[elanjacobs]

That's the angle of the face of the tooth relative to a straight line from the centre of the blade to the tooth tip. It's generally not shown, but both your links are in that range. Pretty much every wood blade will be unless it specifically says otherwise

[barrysumpter]

Brilliant!
Thanks heaps.

[barrysumpter]

Does it matter if it says "Trim/Finish" ?

[aldav]

That is an ATB (Alternate Top Bevel) blade, I would consider it pretty ordinary though. The tooth shape is actually more of what I would expect to see on a rip blade. Have a look here to get a better idea of what blade is best for which purpose - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLGqGWFvIUs

To better understand tooth shapes and configurations have a look here - Saw Tip Angles Explained (http://www.carbideprocessors.com/pages/saw-blades/saw-tip-angles.html)

Using the correct, quality, blade makes an incredible difference to the quality of the cut. It's the difference of being able to glue up panels straight off the saw or having to go to the jointer after the saw and before the glue-up. With a very good crosscut blade you don't need to 'shoot' end grain. Having said all that there are forum members who swear by their preferred choice of combination blade, and I'd have to agree that some of them do a very good job with most, but not all, woods.

[barrysumpter]

Getting too late to focus after a 5am wake up.

Bit tricky at the best of times.

I need a simple app that asks the questions.
Then tells me what and where.

[barrysumpter]

The support on this topic has been brilliant!

Many thanks.

[aldav]

Keeping it simple, from the Freud range:
Good for ripping and crosscutting - https://www.amazon.com/Freud-LU84R009-Combination-PermaShield-Coating/dp/B0000225V9/ref=pd_sim_469_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B0000225V9&pd_rd_r=7MR6C8FZ4ZFN2R151RK1&pd_rd_w=6egHB&pd_rd_wg=qR99W&psc=1&refRID=7MR6C8FZ4ZFN2R151RK1
Excellent for crosscutting (don't know why they would call this a ripping blade?) -https://www.amazon.com/Freud-Tooth-Crosscutting-Ripping-LU88R009/dp/B00004T7PR/ref=pd_bxgy_469_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B00004T7PR&pd_rd_r=P6K547W7SSEBDT09SH3V&pd_rd_w=n2Ncc&pd_rd_wg=Cz3n9&psc=1&refRID=P6K547W7SSEBDT09SH3V
Excellent for ripping - https://www.amazon.com/Freud-LU87R009-Ripping-PermaShield-Coating/dp/B00004T7PP/ref=pd_bxgy_469_img_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B00004T7PP&pd_rd_r=4XHRMV901296C2GRM0XW&pd_rd_w=o96fh&pd_rd_wg=YgjAZ&psc=1&refRID=4XHRMV901296C2GRM0XW

There are other good brands out there that have similar products in their range. I like Freud (can you tell?) because of the quality of their product and the noise suppression features they have. That's a whole other subject though! :D

[barrysumpter]

all my cross cutting is done on my makita drop saw.

Is the 22 teeth the secret for excellent ripping?

[aldav]

all my cross cutting is done on my makita drop saw.

Is the 22 teeth the secret for excellent ripping?


Yes, that tooth count and geometry (flat top tooth) is excellent for ripping. There are even more specialist ripping blades available, but possibly not in the size you need.

[barrysumpter]

Yeah, trying to find the 9-1/4" (235mm) with 20 to 22 teeth.
Jeez!

[barrysumpter]

How about this one:
https://www.carbatec.com.au/blades/circular-saw-blades/cmt-saw-blade-235-x-25-x-24t-ripping-blade-suits-triton
LOL even says suits triton

[aldav]

Yep, or this one if you want a flat top grind - https://www.timbecon.com.au/sawing/circular-saw-blades/ripping-circular-saw-blades

[John.G]

I started with a green bottle of liquid used to remove grime before tapeing / sticking things to glass.

But it wouldn't clear the tar/oil buildup.

Went to soft sand paper on the dremil take off.
Wouldn't take it off either.

Moved to the copper colored wheel brush.
Took it off.
Was careful about holding it there too long.

Took forever.

The best saw cleaning method - removes gum, kino, sap, latex, prevents rust as a bonus - is diesel. Spray it on, let it soak in a bit... and most of the gunk will just wipe off, though if the deposits are heavy sometimes it might take a few sprays to get them to soften up.

[Chrism3]

Barry, one other factor you may wish to consider is the kerf width. Many 9 1/4' blades are now thin kerf, and you will likely find as I did that if the kerf width is too thin then your stock will foul the Triton splitter upon exit. The Triton splitter assumes a kerf width of at least 3mm. I found it best to not go below 2.8mm. Some brands do not bother to list kerf width, some do.
I bought an Irwin 95035 a while back which is 2.8mm and is fine. but now the Professional range appears to have gone thin kerf - I have one which is only 1.8mm, which I can't use in tabletop mode.
I also bought some Bosch blades on special from a store close. One is a Bosch Optiline Wood which is 2.5mm and works OK. Item number is 2608640887.
But two are Speedline Wood and the kerf is only 1.8mm, which I also cannot use. Numbers for these are 2608641104 and 2608642362. Bosch mark their kerf widths on the box and/or the blade.
I did find a Medalist Professional brand going cheap that has a 2.5mm width which is OK.

These are all 40 or 60 tooth blades, but they have their equivalents in fewer tooth blades.

[barrysumpter]

Darn!

Yes was thinking about that off and on during my search.

Just returned from Carba-tec with the 1.8mm one listed above.

That listed as Suites Triton.

Must be the saw not the table.

grrrrr.

[barrysumpter]

Been having issues with the guard support lately anyway.
had to allow 3mm instead of just 1mm on the back fence.
I'm ready for an upgrade.
been thinking about ways to remove it permanently.

[barrysumpter]

Something like this:
Table Saw Overarm Dust Collection - by Routerisstillmyname @ LumberJocks.com ~ woodworking community (http://lumberjocks.com/projects/66895)

with the arms coming down from my rafters.
with the triton blade guard on the end.

[Chrism3]

The splitter is there for a reason, not just to hold the dust guard.

[barrysumpter]

Yeah, kinda.

Even better:
Over blade dust collection for table saw. - by Lumberpunk @ LumberJocks.com ~ woodworking community (http://lumberjocks.com/projects/149978)

[barrysumpter]

Went out to measure for the over blade dust hood and found the new blade kerf is 2.8.
Must have decided on the other ad.
Will have to test it after all.
Might build it anyway.

Product Specifications
Brand CMT
# Teeth 24
Blade Diameter 235mm
Bore 25mm
Grind 10deg ATB
Hook Angle 20deg
Plate Thickness 1.8mm

the plate thickness must not be the same as the kerf
my bad

[barrysumpter]

The guard support is 2.8 by my digital calipers.
Way to close for me.

[Chrism3]

I've been using a 2.8 OK for some time.

[barrysumpter]

you must have yours calibrated exactly aligned.

[barrysumpter]

Finally!
5 hours +

Special thanks to:
dohboy from 10+ years ago
http://www.woodworkforums.com/f15/triton-workcentre-blade-alignment-tips-tricks-36439

Found the riving blade/Dust Guard support on the table top is out 1mm.
So the instructions need to include this issue.

Tested on 6mm ply.
Like skating on ice.

So smooth and easy.

The tear out is terrible.
(A quick pass over on my 18v Makita handheld sander sort thats out quick enough!)

Considerably more satisfying.

Then tested on 50mm x 50mm hardwood.

Slides so much easier on a new clean sharp perfectly aligned low tooth ripping specific blade.
With heaps of blade scratches left over compared to a 60 tooth blade.

So tempted to run thru the jointer to clean up.
Jointer depth is currently around 1.5.
Wonder if I set it at .5 or maybe .2

[barrysumpter]

Thanks to all for their brilliant and consistent support with this topic.
Never slowed even during the Red Page crisis.
Much appreciated.

[Lappa]

I buy Bosch and Makita blades for my 235mm Makita saw. Have a 20t for ripping, a 40t general use and an 80t for ply etc. All available from my local hardware.