Folding pocket knives [Archive]

fenderbelly

29th August 2016, 12:22 AM

In the last 10 years I've moved four times, I'm still looking for stuff that I know I've got, "but where is it".
Anyway today I came across a folding pocket knife in a leather case which is meant to hang on your belt.
Don't know how long I've had it but it goes back a long way. It has a shark motif on the handle.

Now in my younger days all of us kids had a pocket knife.
It was really cool to sit with your mates and clean your fingernails with the point of your knife
or just slice an apple if you were lucky enough to get one.

It was used on your fishing gear or just to whittle a piece of wood.

Anyway today when I came across the knife I thought I would give it to my grandson.
He's responsible, fourteen years old and an army cadet. He goes fishing and camping with his father
and so will come in handy. Or so I thought.

In the deep recesses of my mind I had the feeling it may just be illegal. Did a quick google and the result is I'm confused.

The knife in question has to be opened and closed using two hands.
It would be on a belt and so not concealed but I'm still confused.

have we any law enforcers on here with advice.
I don't want to ask my local guy cos then even I might lose it.

China

29th August 2016, 01:27 AM

Taxi driver mate of mine had a Olfa knife confiscated and was reported for caring a offensive weapon, in SA ( don't know about other states) you can not carry a knife of any kind, due to stupid badly conceived and badly written regulations, having said that I have carried a folding knife on my belt for 50+ years and I am not about to stop now.

Canisbellum

29th August 2016, 05:34 AM

Supposedly you can carry one "for a good reason" but the sheeple will be the problem. I have always had one in my pocket and will continue to do so, but most people have Ben brainwashed into thinking "weapon" when they see one.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

Poppa

29th August 2016, 02:04 PM

I carry my leatherman when I'm working in our family business, because I'm often called on to fix things or make minor repairs or things like that. I also carry my leatherman when I'm working in the workshop or the garden, and I don't bother to take it off if I need to dash up to the hardware shop or whatever. I usually wear it when I'm walking about town to the bank, post office or whatever. From what I understand of the law, as long as it isn't a prohibited weapon (there is a list that includes flick knives, balisongs, shurikans, push daggers, trench knives, spring knives, ballistic knives, and anything similar to any of those), and as long as the blade is less than 4 inches long, it is legal to carry a pocket knife such as a leatherman. You may be asked to justify carrying it, and it is illegal to carry any blade into a school or any such area unless you have a very good reason (like you're a tradie installing carpet for instance). I would also suggest that carrying a knife for self defence is not a good idea. If you were to take a knife out in a confrontational situation I think you'd be in heaps of trouble, even if it was just a small pocket knife. So carrying a knife to a pub to have a drink is not something I would do. I would also not take a knife on a night out - I reckon that would be construed as carrying it for the purposes of using it as a weapon. I do take my leatherman in my laptop case when I go to client sites to do IT work, but not carried on my person. The number of times I've needed it to cut a cable tie, undo a screw, fix a chair, etc, make it a very handy thing to have.

groverwa

29th August 2016, 02:14 PM

I have still got the folding pocket knife that was issued as part of the tools when I joined the then PMG in Jan 1964 in Perth.

Mike

Old-Biker-UK

30th August 2016, 09:25 AM

My Grandfather gave me a penknife when I was 11 yo, pretty much first thing I did was to cut my finger... "That's sharp" says I, "You'll not find much use for a blunt one" was my Pop's sympathetic reply.
I have carried a knife (or two) on my person ever since, must use one at least 10 times a day around the garden & workshop.
(Needed even more now I have some plastic teeth :~)

Mark
Opinel carbon steel folding (No.7)
Mora laminated steel (4") in a belt sheath

rustynail

30th August 2016, 01:49 PM

"Can be carried for good reason." It's all in the detail. You can be done for carrying a screwdriver !
Burning question is - When does a household tool become an offensive weapon? Short answer -Upon suspicion.
Life gets tedious don't it.

rrich

30th August 2016, 02:17 PM

I can think of two folding pocket knives (Swiss Army type) that I know where they are but still missing.
1 - In possession of TSA, Kahului airport
2 - In possession of TSA, Kona airport

It used to be, hand the SAK to TSA, walk through the metal detector, TSA hands the knife back to you. But now stupidity reigns.

issatree

30th August 2016, 08:42 PM

Hi All,
Yes I've carried a Pocket Knife, since I was 15/16 yrs old, almost 80 now. Lost a couple. Keep buying new ones now & then.
I'm told a Knife is a weapon if it has a locking blade.
My knife has a Neoprene covering, so it doesn't wear my pocket out, nothing special, just a knife.

fenderbelly

30th August 2016, 11:55 PM

Thanks for the input guys, I think i'll keep the knife.

Chief Tiff

31st August 2016, 10:27 AM

You say your grandson is a responsible 14 YO? I would have no problem in giving him something like this providing that I'd stressed that it is neither a toy nor a status symbol. In other words the only time it would come out of his room is when he as actually using it round the house, and the only time he carried it around was when he was fishing or camping. Giving him this could be perceived as a measure of your trust in him.

This can actually be quite a sentimental gift; my father bought me a Swiss Army knife as a Xmas present when I was in my early twenties; I still have it now and it travels with me constantly. At work it lives in my pocket full time, at home it usually lives on my bedside cabinet. He passed away nearly ten years ago but it's a constant reminder of him.

rustynail

31st August 2016, 11:34 AM

Thanks for the input guys, I think i'll keep the knife.
Sad when it comes to this.
I still have a pocket knife my father gave me fifty five years ago.
On the other hand, I have several scars from knife attacks while working as a "bouncer" in hotels in my younger days. Usually a knife is easily separated from the wielder in a face to face situation, but soon gets ugly if you're shived from behind.
Upon presenting a lad with a pocket knife you give him the onus of responsibility. This is important for every child's development. To deny him that seems more "criminal" than the alternative.
I gave my son his first knife when he was nine. I gave it to him with my shirt off. He knows that is not what nice people use knives for.

doug3030

31st August 2016, 01:31 PM

Poppa

31st August 2016, 03:09 PM

My oldest boy (15) has at least 3 knives that I know of. He knows he isn't allowed to take them with him when he goes out. My 10 yr old daughter has been "carving" with me for a couple of years now. I only let her use the rasps and files, not a knife, but she can't wait to be old enough to use a knife. She used to object terribly about only being allowed to use the rasps and files until she stuck the sharp point of a rasp into the pad of her hand. No objections since then... :)

Old-Biker-UK

1st September 2016, 04:47 AM

I fail to understand the logic behind a recent experience, when I got air side at an airport I went to a restaurant and they give me a bigger knife than the one that would have been taken away from me at the check-in.

Mark

Kidbee

1st September 2016, 08:13 AM

I too have been a long time pocket knife carrier, in a pouch, and like a lot of earlier posts it has sentimental value.

Being a country music follower, Troy Cassar Daley has just released a new song entitled 'Things I Carry Around' and the beginning of his song has these words:

'That Old Timer knife my grandpa gave to me,
has worn a hole in a hundred pair of jeans'.

Mine is an Old Timer as well, but made well before they started getting manufactured in China.

Here is a Youtube Video of the song in question and his much treasured EH Holden, that will bring a lot of memories back for some of you.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uTp1InlMPf0

ian

1st September 2016, 05:13 PM

Thanks for the input guys, I think i'll keep the knife.
Hi Fred

Gift the knife to your grandson.
emphasize the personal responsibility bit and that a pocket knife is a tool not a weapon and particularly that it's not for self defense.

Unfortunately, the issue goes beyond on of a nanny state.
I remember the early 90s in Sydney when many male teenagers, when asked why they carried a pocket knife, said it was for self defense.
From memory the typical story was: when confronted the victim extracted his pocket knife, lost it to the attacker who in turn used it to injure the victim.

ian

1st September 2016, 05:16 PM

I have carried a pocket knife from the age of 14 until I moved to Melbourne six years ago and had to stop because of the nanny state's interest in my safety :?

there was a gap of three months when I was 18 and joined the Army. There, the powers that be deemed it too dangerous to have a little pocket knife while doing basic training so they took it off of me on the first day and gave it back at the end.

I have never understood why they did this because the day after they took my pocket knife they gave me a rifle and an eight-inch bayonet to stick on the end of it. Apparently that was not as dangerous as a pocket knife :B
hi Doug

possibly the knife was quarantined because the Army hadn't taught you how to use it? That or you might use it for self harm.

What I remember from my basic training was that the bayonet was very blunt and most of the time the rifle was only a club. Bullets were things we only saw at the range.

Chief Tiff

1st September 2016, 08:49 PM

... when I was 18 and joined the Army. There, the powers that be deemed it too dangerous to have a little pocket knife while doing basic training so they took it off of me on the first day and gave it back at the end.

:?
Clearly the Navy enlists a higher calibre of recruit :rolleyes:; you are GIVEN a pocket knife on Day One as part of your basic kit outfit at Recruit School. Then when you go to sea you are required to carry it around with you as part of your everyday kit (along with a torch, a chinagraph grease pencil and a green Cyalume light chemical light stick).

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s231/kronckew/knives/marineissue.jpg (https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiqx-qV8O3OAhUP42MKHWzqDNgQjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vikingsword.com%2Fvb%2Fprintthread.php%3Ft%3D7278%26page%3D2%26pp%3D40&bvm=bv.131286987,d.dmo&psig=AFQjCNGUl1py85_nP_p20vH6NC0XSNuWvg&ust=1472809186602025)

Oops; sorry to any RAAFies I may have just inadvertently scared the living poop out of with such a terrifying picture :D

doug3030

1st September 2016, 09:30 PM

Well Chief Tiff, Not so sure you should be boasting about the comparative merits of the recruits when they see a need to engrave the equipment with basic maintenance instructions like "oil the joints" :rolleyes:

However one thing will never change is that servicemen and ex-servicemen will take every opportunity to bag the services they were not in.

I used to love it when the Navy guys would make a big deal out of the Navy being the Senior Service. I would tell them that they had to form the Navy first because they knew it would take them longer to get their $#!t together. :wink:

(written in jest in the usual spirit of interservice rivalry)

CHeers

Doug

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s231/kronckew/knives/marineissue.jpg (https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiqx-qV8O3OAhUP42MKHWzqDNgQjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vikingsword.com%2Fvb%2Fprintthread.php%3Ft%3D7278%26page%3D2%26pp%3D40&bvm=bv.131286987,d.dmo&psig=AFQjCNGUl1py85_nP_p20vH6NC0XSNuWvg&ust=1472809186602025)

Oops; sorry to any RAAFies I may have just inadvertently scared the living poop out of with such a terrifying picture :D

Lyle

1st September 2016, 10:03 PM

Had one of those for ages. Had to modify it by cutting of the pointy bit used on ropes and welding on a Phillips screwdriver. It. Was a great tool then on the Caribous and Iroquois. Could open any panel and adjust heaps of things. Still got it somewhere.

Chief Tiff

1st September 2016, 10:06 PM

"Oil the joints" is nothing compared to the instructions on a Claymore mine; "This side Towards The Enemy" :p

I think we can agree that when using a knife we didn't so much "cut away from the body" as "always cut towards the nearest Commissioned Officer" :rolleyes:

doug3030

1st September 2016, 10:57 PM

"Oil the joints" is nothing compared to the instructions on a Claymore mine; "This side Towards The Enemy" :p

Come on Chief, we all know that the instructions on the Claymore mine are there for the Americans. It's their kit after all. :wink:

The Australian Army gets at least as much mirth out of that inscription as our Navy does.

Cheers

Doug

1st September 2016, 11:20 PM

I'm surprised claymore's don't say "Aim away from face"

I can't remember not owning a pocket knife. Rather sad that Wenger are no more and only Victorinox remains. Still, bought one recently and it is a good thing. My SOG multi is a bit bulky most days. Had Kershaw, Wenger, Opinel, and others. Can't imagine getting my first one in my teens though...

Chief Tiff

2nd September 2016, 12:26 AM

Hi Fred,

Just to recap the major points and views that I feel have been expressed here:

1) A pocket knife is viewed as only a tool by the overwhelming majority of people. Those members of society who would claim that no-one should be allowed one as these can be "a weapon" I will cheerfully ignore on the basis that are highly unlikely to have any real experience of either and acquiescing to their un-informed viewpoint gives unearned power to the feeble. Besides; they don't subscribe to this forum.

2) To a young teen being given such an item is almost a rite of passage; it demonstrates to them that they have earned the trust of their elders and have been judged as responsible; another stepping stone to adulthood. All those little points we all experienced growing up; getting our first sips of beer, sitting on dad's lap as we steered the car, baiting our own hook... ok; I'm waffling a bit here but basically society want us to totally insulate our young from all responsibility and potential hurt while expecting that on the 18th birthday suddenly there is a lightbulb moment and the child suddenly becomes an adult. Right...

3) A gift like this is something that will never fade from memory. We all remember our first knives and we all remember who gave them to us.

4) The Navy is, was and always will be the best branch of the Defence Force.:cool:

doug3030

2nd September 2016, 12:33 AM

no problems with points 1, 2 and 3 chief Tiff, after that you are on pretty shaky ground (or should that be waters) :rolleyes:

CHeers

Doug

ian

2nd September 2016, 02:44 AM

I don't think I've ever seen a bigger hi-jack ...
The Navy is, was and always will be the best branch of the Defence Force.:cool:
which really deserves its own thread

AlexS

2nd September 2016, 09:28 AM

Ah yes, the EH Premier, had oe of those, my first decent car.

his much treasured EH Holden, that will bring a lot of memories back for some of you. Just wondering how many Gen Xers were conceived in the back of one of those.

Chief Tiff, I was given one of those when I did my (civilian) coxswains cert. Very useful, used it for splicing, cutting a tow that went wrong and lots of other things. I seem to remember being issued with one in the army, too, can't be sure now.

rustynail

2nd September 2016, 10:08 AM

It's not the knife that is the problem, it's that silly nut that you often find on the end of the handle.

issatree

2nd September 2016, 11:33 AM

Hi All Again,
About time I thought, to clean up the front of the Bench.
UMM, whats in that, low & behold, 2 Folding Pocket Knives.
Stanley Rogers, 440 Stainless, Japan.
7¼in. length of Opened Locked Knife.
Single Blade 2¾in. Partial Wooden Handle with Brass Pins & S/S at the Blade holding end. Quite heavy, but very nice.

Other one is a 4 Blade by Kutmaster, Utica, or Utiga NY. Made in USA.
Main Blade ruined by a file, Screwdriver-Bottle Opener, very small Curved Blade 1in. then 1½in. Blade tapers to a point with serrated back, that I take to have been a small rasp. Bone handle with Brass Name Plate. Reason for Imperial is that was what it wood have been.
These Blades do not Lock.
Very Pleased with my find.

ian

2nd September 2016, 02:25 PM

Clearly the Navy enlists a higher calibre of recruit :rolleyes:; you are GIVEN a pocket knife on Day One as part of your basic kit outfit at Recruit School. Then when you go to sea you are required to carry it around with you as part of your everyday kit

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s231/kronckew/knives/marineissue.jpg (https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiqx-qV8O3OAhUP42MKHWzqDNgQjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vikingsword.com%2Fvb%2Fprintthread.php%3Ft%3D7278%26page%3D2%26pp%3D40&bvm=bv.131286987,d.dmo&psig=AFQjCNGUl1py85_nP_p20vH6NC0XSNuWvg&ust=1472809186602025)

I seem to remember being issued with one in the army, too, can't be sure now.
it is (or was) described as a Sapper's knife and was issued to all Sappers

Bushmiller

2nd September 2016, 11:06 PM

Chief Tiff

For a long time I had my father's knife, which was similar to that and army issue. I don't know what happened to it. I never worked out what that spike was for either, although my best guess would be splicing rope.

I always have around three knives of a sort with me, but not on me. I have to hand a back pack, which carries just about everything I need. In that back pack is a small pouch which has sets of screwdrivers, jeweler's screwdrivers and many other bits an pieces including multitools. That is where the knives are located. There are two Gerber tools (standard size and a mini size) and an el cheapo multi tool, which I must throw out.

For a long time before that I used to have an Old Timer knife, but that got lost in the paddock.

Regards
Paul

Twisted Tenon

4th September 2016, 09:09 PM

I used to work in the Court system when Bob Carr's new anti knife legislation hit. It didn't take long before people were fronting the court with "Possess Prohibited Weapon" charges. 95% of which were those little key chain knives. These were back up charges to drunk and disorderly, resist police, DIU type charges. Invariably the offender pleaded guilty to ALL the charges and now would have a serious offence on their records.

I've seen a concreter charged with a weapons offence for having a spade he'd sharpened up to clean up his form work timbers. I saw another builder charged for having a machete in his kit he used for all sorts of odd jobs. He was charged with this along with his drink driving offence. It wasn't worth it to them to challenge the offences in Court. Easier to pay the fines and get back to work.

I carry a small pen knife with me that I keep in the coin section of my wallet. It often passed through the Court metal detectors and was never picked up. It looked like a USB drive on the screen.

A pen knife is a most useful tool that has now been criminalised.

TT

A Duke

4th September 2016, 10:06 PM

Hi,
A pen knife is just that, it is for sharpening your quill.
Regards

A Duke

5th September 2016, 12:38 PM

Hi,
Well if the pen is mightier than the sword I suppose a knife for sharpening pens is a weapon.
:D
Regards

cava

5th September 2016, 01:25 PM

I was under the impression that the 'spike' on a pocket knife was for agricultural pursuits such as for horse's/sheep feet etc. Maybe I am wrong?

rustynail

5th September 2016, 04:10 PM

I was under the impression that the 'spike' on a pocket knife was for agricultural pursuits such as for horse's/sheep feet etc. Maybe I am wrong?
Prior to the ring-pull can , the only method to access the contents was with a can opener. In the case of a liquid content this was rendered unnecessary by the use of the spike.

Chief Tiff

5th September 2016, 08:26 PM

I was under the impression that the 'spike' on a pocket knife was for agricultural pursuits such as for horse's/sheep feet etc. Maybe I am wrong?

Back when livestock was commonly used for pulling carts etc some knives had a spike to dig out stones etc from horses hooves, but on the sailors clasp knife the spike is used when splicing ropes. Fibre ropes were spliced using a "fid" which is a wooden spike, wire ropes were spliced with a steel "marlin spike"; the spike on the knife is adequate for splicing modern synthetic fibre rope up to about 3/4".

However; as has been said although it may have been designed for a specific purpose the spike found itself being used more of a puncturing tool. Anywhere the Royal Navy has sailed since 1970 can be found by following the trail of beer cans on the seabed with holes stabbed in their sides to sink them.

Chief Tiff

5th September 2016, 08:36 PM

Prior to the ring-pull can , the only method to access the contents was with a can opener. In the case of a liquid content this was rendered unnecessary by the use of the spike.

Don't forget the Church Key!

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7e/Churchkey_patent_1996550.jpg/220px-Churchkey_patent_1996550.jpg (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Churchkey_patent_1996550.jpg)