Masters no more

[justonething]

Masters are closing their doors (http://www.smh.com.au/business/retail/fire-sale-masters-announces-closing-date-20160824-gr0enp.html).
I like masters for things that I can't easily buy elsewhere. I like their Swanson, Kobalt, Bahco, Bessey etc. as well as their range of varnishes.
I think we'll be worse off with a virtual monopoly in the DIY market.

[rob streeper]

That's too bad. The Lowes stores in my area are in a kind of zombie state, clearly still well patronized but the staff is less knowledgeable, the product range is narrowing to the highest volume items and the prices are generally higher for equivalent items at the local competitor Home Depot. Online shopping is really killing local specialty stores and the more specialized items carried by the big boxes such as Bessey products. Manufacturers are shifting the burden of maintaining stock onto the end user - either have it on hand or wait a week to order online. I think the big boxes will only carry items that are too heavy or impractical to ship easily via parcel carriers in the future.

[Yanis]

Woolworths posted a 1.2b loss so they are cutting their losses. Interestingly they are shedding Home hardware to Metcash who already own Mitre 10 leaving pretty much a two horse race for most of us.

However watch out for some pretty good deals in the next few months.

John

[rrich]

I got a giggle out of the video.

There was a comment that was notable:

Lowes didn't understand the Australian market. The comment about snow shovels in summer was hysterical. Lowes is headquartered in Charlotte, North Carolina. The fact that your seasons and our seasons are reversed was lost on Lowes.

Remember with all of their training, a Lowes manager can manage anyone, anywhere, anytime without having to know what they are managing. I can substitute several company names for Lowes based upon personal experience. LOL!

Here in the US, Sears attempted to move into the home center business. Sears acquired Orchard Supply Hardware, a small supply house oriented about the wine industry in the Napa Valley and in reality a very good hardware chain. Sears changed the name to OSH and acquired a lot of sites. Sears headquartered in Chicago managed the stock and the store layout including shelf space arrangements.

SWMBO wanted to walk through the OSH in Huntington Beach when the store first opened. As we were walking through the store, she starts giggling. I asked her, "What are you laughing at?" SWMBO points and says, "Those are sump pumps, aren't they?" Yes, there was about 2 M of shelf space dedicated to displaying 6 or 8 different models of sump pumps. Her astute observation was, "They aren't going to stay in business very long."

In Huntington Beach, except for a few multistory commercial buildings, there are probably less than 10 basements in the city. All the houses are built on either a slab or a half meter crawl space. In my neighborhood the water table is 1.5 M which makes a basement almost impossible.

[bueller]

Masters are closing their doors (http://www.smh.com.au/business/retail/fire-sale-masters-announces-closing-date-20160824-gr0enp.html).
I like masters for things that I can't easily buy elsewhere. I like their Swanson, Kobalt, Bahco, Bessey etc. as well as their range of varnishes.
I think we'll be worse off with a virtual monopoly in the DIY market.

Yeah definitely a shame. Was there buying a Swanson speed square a couple of weeks ago and was surprised to see the Bessey line there. Might have to try and catch some on sale before they disappear, there are only a couple of places here that sell them and the selection is quite limited.

[Yanis]

Good for locals to report on any price reductions they see. :)

John

[david.elliott]

I'll miss 'em a bit. I do like the floor poly for benchtops, they stock Bostik floor glues which B don't and I've had a great run with all of their "cheapie" Kobalt home brand hand tool stuff. It's quite good quality for the buck...909 not so much..

[Mobyturns]

Its a sad day as Masters carried some good brands including Franklin glues -Titebond etc. More jobs gone! Looks like my sister in laws brother is now jobless.

Just maybe one day in the future these idiot senior management teams that "can manage anybody, anything, anywhere" ( sounds a bit like the Goodies TV comedy) will actually listen to their retail teams and customers before they go broke! We often see surf rods in sports stores in Far North Queensland - I think the only people who purchase them are southerners that pick up a bargain when they are grossly marked down. Though I haven't seen a snow blower in the Masters store in Cairns.

[Kuffy]

I just went to Masters to pick up some finishing supplies and a elcheapo lamp so I can see what I am doing on the woodlathe. Because I spent more than $25 they were giving away FREE lufkin tape measures. The tape measure isn't the best, but it is very good. All different colours and patterns printed on the plastic casing. For some DUMB DUMB DUMB reason, I picked the one which looked like a timber offcut. I have enough trouble finding my fluorescent orange tape measure...:doh:

[crowie]

Bugger...I am just getting used to the Masters store in Penrith [outer Sydney]; it has some good product....

[Simplicity]

I wonder what Bunnings management are thinking.
I spend a lot at both stores ever year( five figure amount)
With masters gone it could become quite scary.
Mitre Ten are really not in the same league

[dai sensei]

Been visiting Masters for the past 2 weeks buying stuff at 30-60% off, all fixings 50% off, interesting how low it will go now decision made to close

[justonething]

It seems some of the items stocked by Masters are indeed quite popular and sought after.
I often wonder if masters were run differently, concentrating on stocking those items then they might not be suffering the same fate. But bad management and wrong strategies has cost woolies billion and us a place to buy what we want .

[Yanis]

I started off my life in hardware and it is certainly a tricky business. It is a fine line between diversifying and spreading your butter too thin. Look at JB who are now getting into white goods. Not sure how well they will do against the established markets. They cannot sell $500 HDMI cables with fridges :)

It seems to me that Masters was a good idea poorly implemented. Partnering with a US company made it easier to initially access supply chains but giving them too much control over stocking policies appears to be a serious mistake.

Obviously we may never have an insight into the market research and planning that was done. It is easy to see the mistakes in hindsight and one would have expected better from a company that had so much retail experience.

The mistakes they are making makes one wonder whether they have completely dropped the ball. This coming hard on the heels of DSE. They are also seeing a big challenge from the likes of Aldi as well.

Not sure If I envy their shoes.

John

[chris0375]

The real shame is there is almost no one left to at least try and give Bunnings competition. Sure there are independent stores etc but almost none are open late or have anywhere near the Bunnings range.

I used to work in hardware. Mitre 10 and thrifty link. Both of those stores have closed. Main reason in my mind is stock management and stock selection. I think this is also a major downfall of Masters.

The Masters near me had about 3 different drawers slides available. Generally very good selection of nuts and bolts and fittings etc but obscenely expensive. At least when it first opened they had no 1/4 inch fasteners. I generally hate imperial but wanted to match something.

Very hit and miss whereas Bunnings will almost always have something that will work to fix a particular problem.

Masters website is generally horrible. The search feature is terrible. The store stock is not kept up to date either. No excuses for these failures in this day and age from such a large consumer focused retailer.

[chambezio]

I find it hard to understand why businesses go belly up when on the face of things they look to be a good business.
In Tamworth about 20 years ago Formica opened a warehouse to distribute their laminates and board products. We already had a Laminex branch successfully doing there thing. Formica organised an investor to build the shed and at the time it was the biggest shed in the southern hemisphere using plywood portal frames. Well the opening was a pretty lavish affair and a couple of hundred people turned up to hear speeches from the Australian GM as well as the NSW manager then the local manager. The line up of faces on the dais were all about 40 at the oldest. I remember thinking "where are the older people in charge?".
Well the branch ran for maybe 4 years then pulled up stumps leaving customers having to ring Sydney to make an order which was then put on overnight freight. The shed was still paying its lease by Formica even though it was empty!!

To me the exercise was a great waste of money due to immature management ideas. The share holders would not have been very happy at all. Then as time goes by Laminex Industries buys out Formica. This also raise the question....at what point does the term "monopoly" come into play because both companies carry the same products?

Money is being wasted by all kinds of companies by management that seems to get away with it.

Edit/Add.... the real losers are the staff. In country towns employment is not so easy to find/keep so in essence these badly managed companies are playing with people's lives.

[david.elliott]

What I found interesting was that when Masters first opened it "felt" like the attitude of staff at the B store changed overnight. All of a sudden they were everywhere, walked you to what you asked for, and everyone of them nodded and said G'day when they saw you...then, when the M sale or closing became common knowledge it was like B turned the clock back. Spooky.

Was trying to buy paint in B at Armadale WA on Sunday along with about 6 others standing around the paint counter. Just a litre of red for a door.. Actually considered walking out and going the M 500mts away. There has always been someone at their paint counter, apart from late evening once.

When we found the staff at B there was a young lass and fellow in one of the aisles.
She was stacking shelves and he was trying it on...my wife, not famous for her diplomacy sometimes, pointedly pointed out that there were folk, including us, waiting he was nonplussed and casually made his way to the counter...

[Glenn.Visca]

I have noticed similar at a couple local green sheds. More interested in restocking than serving customers who want to destock.

[chris0375]

To me the exercise was a great waste of money due to immature management ideas.

I think it's a bit ageist to suggest that simply because the people you saw were less than 40 they somehow made immature decisions.

I know of a very large, top 50 USA companies, that closed almost all warehouses Australia wide. An extremely detailed analysis suggested that it was most efficient to have one large warehouse in Melbourne and freight everything from there. Overheads were reduced enabling the company to be more competitive. Remember freight to 80% plus of Australia's population would be less than a days driving.

[bueller]

What I found interesting was that when Masters first opened it "felt" like the attitude of staff at the B store changed overnight. All of a sudden they were everywhere, walked you to what you asked for, and everyone of them nodded and said G'day when they saw you...then, when the M sale or closing became common knowledge it was like B turned the clock back. Spooky.

Was trying to buy paint in B at Armadale WA on Sunday along with about 6 others standing around the paint counter. Just a litre of red for a door.. Actually considered walking out and going the M 500mts away. There has always been someone at their paint counter, apart from late evening once.

When we found the staff at B there was a young lass and fellow in one of the aisles.
She was stacking shelves and he was trying it on...my wife, not famous for her diplomacy sometimes, pointedly pointed out that there were folk, including us, waiting he was nonplussed and casually made his way to the counter...
I don't know if it's just the times I go but Morley Bunnings seems to always be like that, never any staff around and only one counter ringing up sales. So annoying.

[david.elliott]

Maddington only EVER has one till open. When it gets busy you go to the returns counter...
The rest are the DIY things. Now I'm perfectly capable of using those, they don't faze me, BUT I point blank refuse to. Getting "served" to take the money off me is most times all they need to do to take money off me.
I drive there, I walk around in circles to find what I need, effectively serving myself, and then they expect me pay by myself...It's not like they're doing much for my dollar except putting it on the shelf..and IF their claims were true with the prices I could kinda agree to it...but!

[bueller]

Maddington only EVER has one till open. When it gets busy you go to the returns counter...
The rest are the DIY things. Now I'm perfectly capable of using those, they don't faze me, BUT I point blank refuse to. Getting "served" to take the money off me is most times all they need to do to take money off me.
I drive there, I walk around in circles to find what I need, effectively serving myself, and then they expect me pay by myself...It's not like they're doing much for my dollar except putting it on the shelf..and IF their claims were true with the prices I could kinda agree to it...but!
It's so frustrating. They have the gall to actually close the self service checkouts at mine so you wind up with 10 people lined up at one counter.

[justonething]

Might be a lot faster than that... looks like they closed their Ebay store overnight and today the stock management system went offline. Online ordering and "click and collect" is also now offline... so they killed their distro literally overnight...

One must now ring stores directly to check stock level and availability.


I got an email today from masters :
----------------------------------
Unfortunately, we will be unable to continue offering online purchases or Click & Collect. Of course, our website is still available to browse for information and we will keep you up to date with what's on offer via email.

It looks like mangagement has decided the best way to wind the place up is through the brick and mortar outlet. First in best dressed.

[justonething]

It concerns me mightily that a disorganised rats nest like Bunnings is the only choice for many.

i hope smaller businesses take up the opportunity to fly into the gap.

Over the last 12 months I've taken great pains to find all the small suppliers here in Canberra. The little guys and specialty places, but my number one frustration is finding from them what they sell and their prices. Many, if not most, are their own worst enemies.

I like to use them. It feels good, plus they invariably offer identical prices, can order in more variety and offer decent service. They just need to get better at advising exactly what they sell.

May be we should start a non-bunings timber and hardware thread where people can post the good local places where they get good stuff. For example, where would one goes to get titebond 3 if they don't want to go Carbatec after Masters have closed?

[Bohdan]

Been visiting Masters for the past 2 weeks buying stuff at 30-60% off, all fixings 50% off, interesting how low it will go now decision made to close

Dropped in on Masters at Williams Landing to see what might be on special - only some junk near the checkouts and a few odd white goods, everything else at full price. It appears discounting varies from store to store so if you see any store that is discounting let us all know.

[Dareen]

Hi WP,

eviscerated

Great word. Leaves me in no doubt as to your explanation.

Cheers, Fred

[Sam]

I went down to my local and it was business as usual except triple the customers all wandering around not buying. Read online afterwards that the fire sale starts monday Masters fire sale to start Monday (http://www.smh.com.au/business/retail/masters-fire-sale-to-start-monday-20160826-gr25au.html)

[Pac man]

At Rouse Hill now. I predict a slow and painful death.
sale announced in Media and similiar customer numbers as per a normal day.
10% off most
20% off garden furniture
30 % off cabinet fixings and door hardware

make sure you say hello to the security guard in the tool shop as they are lonely and have nothing to do

[NathanaelBC]

... was surprised to see the Bessey line there. Might have to try and catch some on sale before they disappear

AFAIK they stock just the one length of one model of Bessey clamps; I buy my Bessey's from gettoolsdirect.com.au - they stock them all.

GTD's packing is a little light-on though, considering that's $400 of clamps there:

392319

[Mr Brush]

This seems to be the new normal....no such thing as a "fire sale" any more. Dick Smith 2.0 more like. Long drive for me to the nearest Masters (Gregory Hills), so not worth the trip unless there are some decent discounts.

[FenceFurniture]

Seems to me that Masters and the liquidator have got rocks in their heads. I can confirm Pac Man's assessment of almost uniformly 10% and no customers in sight.

This is ludicrous: they are now paying for security guards, and the longer the sale goes on the longer they will be paying wages to the staff. If we assume that the liquidator is getting 10% of all sales, then Masters could have put the sale on themselves at 20% off and had a helluva lot more stock go out the door sooner and made the same amount of margin, but raised a lot more money. (obviously the discounts will increase in the coming months).

Had it been 20% I'd have purchased up to $1800 less discount, but as it was I only took out what I have a need for right now to the tune of about $500 (and $300 of that was just for four rolls of Bird Wire for the new massive vege garden).

I made the point to the 'merican store visitor that if it had been a decent discount right from the get-go then a simple post on the various fora could be seen by maybe 10,000 people. As it is, it's business (or lack of) as usual. I mean - think about it - a thread titled "Masters 25% off" is going to get a lot of views translating to feet through the door.

Fixings are 30% off and I have a need for 5 boxes of screws so that was really only what bumped it into "worth the 90 minute return trip". Other than that, check back in 4-5 weeks to see if they've woken up.

Didn't even see any snow shovels at a decent price (hey, we're coming into summer so they should be on display by now :D).

[Pac man]

AFAIK they stock just the one length of one model of Bessey clamps; I buy my Bessey's from gettoolsdirect.com.au - they stock them all.

GTD's packing is a little light-on though, considering that's $400 of clamps there:



They sell both the 600 and the 1m in the k bodies

prices are $74 less 10% and 91 less 10% accordingly

[Mr Brush]

They don't seem to understand that if they get people into the stores on the pretence of a "closing sale", but only offer crappy discounts, the punters won't bother coming back in a few weeks' time if/when they start ramping up the discounts to worthwhile levels.

Same thing happened with Dick Smith, and they got left with lots of (mostly own brand) gear and no more customers. Basically everyone rapidly lost interest and wandered off to look at the shiny things in other stores instead.

[chambezio]

Quote [Seems to me that Masters and the liquidator have got rocks in their heads]

The word "liquidator" immediately made my brain go to Dr Who......Exterminate, Exterminate

[Mr Brush]

Weird...."liquidator" made me think more along these lines

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6WfSZzi4_Y

[Chesand]

I called into the Sunbury store this morning as I was passing,. Carpark 3/4 full, lots of wanderers in the store but not many going through the checkouts. As others have said, the discount seems to be 10% with more on a few lines. 10% on power tools is not enough to get me interested just yet.

[FenceFurniture]

Here is their Facebook page if you want to give them some hurry up:
https://www.facebook.com/mastersau

I posted a nicely paragraphed but long comment but as I was a Visitor it took all the paras out which makes it a chore to read.

[FenceFurniture]

And fresh news:
Woolworths hits Lowe's legal hurdle in Masters sale - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-08-29/woolworths-hits-lowes-hurdle-in-masters-sale/7795414)

[dai sensei]

I went today and so much for the huge sale, it was better last week. The 60% off tables were reduced to 50%, the 50% off all fixing was reduced to 30%, and just the few 10/20/30% bits and pieces as previously. So actually more expensive.

There were plenty of signs saying closing down sale, that kept falling down much to the frustration of staff, but no real discounts being out forward yet.

[crowie]

Dropped in to see my friend at Penrith Masters today....

Lot of people in the store and carpark noticeably fuller....

The staff are one the wiser on what's really happening except to say the liquidator now owns all the stock and responsible for the prices & discounts....

My friends bigger concern is that at least five [5] of the masters suppliers that he knows of, will also have to close their doors, after Masters is wound up....

PS - I did buy a 3.7lt of Titebond Original for my toymaking but really didn't bother looking around....TOO MANY CUSTOMERS TO MANOEUVRE AROUND!!

[justonething]

I also bought Titebond, but Titebond 3, organoil hard burnishing oil and some decking paint. I got 10% + 5% trade discount for everything. Didn't bother with anything else.

[Toymaker Len]

Checked the Masters website early tuesday morning, matched their prices to my list, factored in the 10% 'sale' discount...All looking good, headed out to Heatherbrae to Masters although three Bunnings are closer to my place. First item -piano hinges, website says $11 tag says $15.79! ! Same with push-latches, website $10 tag on the shelf $15, sanding sealer -website says $30 shelf price $35. Sales assistant checks the prices with his little scanner and says "Sorry mate, we don't have anything to do with the website...another mob has bought the shop and these are the prices we have to go by". False advertising!
Bye bye Masters. Never again. Went by the big green shed on the way home, spent $131 and saved about fifty.

[FenceFurniture]

Len, that's actionable. Fair Trading and/or ACCC don't give a toss who owns the stock. If they say it's 10% off then that will apply to the advertised web prices, regardless of what some guy in the store thinks. Otherwise shut down the website completely, not just partially as they have done.

Agree that the sale is not what it should be, given how much stock they have to move. Discounts will become bigger as the weeks go on. There are many who are disgruntled at this so-called firesale, and they are not parting with their readies as a result. See the other thread, "Masters no mor (http://www.woodworkforums.com/f43/masters-208088)e".

[Sawdust Maker]

put a complaint into the ACCC - they can't do anything about this sort of thing if they aren't told about it

https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/complaints-problems/make-a-consumer-complaint

[China]

I would not bother with the ACCC by the time they begin any action the company will have been wound down and no entity left to face the music, just protest with your feet and walk away

[justonething]

When you go into masters. You should notice the sign in front of the return area that says something like all sales are final and the only returns you can have are those afforded by the consumer protection legislation. Looking a bit closer, you will find that their inventory is now owned by the Great American Group (http://www.afr.com/street-talk/three-way-deal-expected-for-woolworths-hardware-sources-20160823-gqzmq8). So when we go in, we are no longer buying from the Woolworths group. Whether Woolworths will still stand behind the products on the shelves (which are now not theirs) is not clear at all. GAG is free to set their prices to any of their items and many items were actually cheaper before fire sale. Fasteners were 50% off, and is now 30% off the retail price. The web site does not reflect what GAG is selling. Beware when you go bargain hunting in there.
For all intent and purposes, Masters are gone already.

[twosheds]

I would just like to thank those that have posted on this thread and the "Masters no more" thread. I had been planning on going to the Heatherbrae Masters for the Fire Sale but after reading the posted comments I put the kybosh on it. Talk about a con job. And to think I would have had to drive another 30km past the Bunnings store at Taylors Beach to get to Masters. A big thumbs up for the forum for the sharing of information.

Regards to all
Twoheds

[crowie]

When you go into masters. You should notice the sign in front of the return area that says something like all sales are final and the only returns you can have are those afforded by the consumer protection legislation. Looking a bit closer, you will find that their inventory is now owned by the Great American Group (http://www.afr.com/street-talk/three-way-deal-expected-for-woolworths-hardware-sources-20160823-gqzmq8). So when we go in, we are no longer buying from the Woolworths group. Whether Woolworths will still stand behind the products on the shelves (which are now not theirs) is not clear at all. GAG is free to set their prices to any of their items and many items were actually cheaper before fire sale. Fasteners were 50% off, and is now 30% off the retail price. The web site does not reflect what GAG is selling. Beware when you go bargain hunting in there.
For all intent and purposes, Masters are gone already.

Any chance of a screen shot of the "inventory is now owned by the great American Group" article, please....

[Sawdust Maker]

I would not bother with the ACCC by the time they begin any action the company will have been wound down and no entity left to face the music, just protest with your feet and walk away

Woolies will still exist
and it's pretty negative to have a go at the regulator without at least telling them what the problem is

[justonething]

392534

[Mike B]

I'm really not sure what some of you guys were expecting in the first week of a 3+ month liquidation. Liquidations are about maximising returns. No doubt it will all make it down to 30% and beyond as the date approaches. The game is keeping your powder dry and hoping someone else doesn't buy it first!

Personally I'm keeping an eye on the Minwax finishes. I know most Bessey clamps won't last past 10% as I watched a guy come in and buy every last TPN screw clamp on the shelf (and up on the shelf in boxes). They were one of the few Masters items that were already cheaper than anywhere else in Oz...

[Big Shed]

Was in Masters at Adelaide Airport yesterday, 2 blokes were busy hanging a sale banner over the big 10% price beating sign outside.

Inside there were lots of signs at the cash registers about no refunds etc.

All wardrobe items were 30% off, I was checking this out for my son who has just purchased another house.

There were some other 30% off signs as well but can't remember what they were for.

[chris0375]

No refunds is fair enough as long as it doesn't infringe on compulsory consumer law. If I was liquidating a business the last thing I would want is returns. They are trying to offload stock not build a business or reputation based on friendly store policies.

I agree there will not be really good discounts on most things. I was in masters over 2 months ago and an employee stated they were trying to get rid of anything high value and carry as little stuff as possible.

Bulky stuff like timber and outdoor settings will probably be discounted sooner rather than later. Brand name tools will be the last thing to be discounted.

[bueller]

I'm really not sure what some of you guys were expecting in the first week of a 3+ month liquidation. Liquidations are about maximising returns. No doubt it will all make it down to 30% and beyond as the date approaches. The game is keeping your powder dry and hoping someone else doesn't buy it first!

Personally I'm keeping an eye on the Minwax finishes. I know most Bessey clamps won't last past 10% as I watched a guy come in and buy every last TPN screw clamp on the shelf (and up on the shelf in boxes). They were one of the few Masters items that were already cheaper than anywhere else in Oz...
Yeah i'm fully expecting all the clamps to be gone by the time the discounts get deep. I have a feeling people will just be buying the Bessey clamps at 10% off just because they're not readily stocked elsewhere in Perth.

I'm just planning on stocking up on sandpaper belts and discs, PPE and possibly some drill bits and blades etc.

[NathanaelBC]

I'd expect a decent discount if I'm not getting the benefit of the option to return for refund, let alone the high risk of warranties not being honoured.

One of the reasons I like shopping at Bunnings is because they're so damn good about returns and refunds. Without those benefits I'd expect to pay less. Just like some people are happy to pay a premium at independent stores for the service and advice.

So, what I'm saying is, 10% off, 20% off even 30% off - it's hardly a bargain because you're not getting something you would have otherwise paid full price for.

[TermiMonster]

I believe that manufacturers' warranties still apply, ie if your bessey clamp breaks, you should be able to return it to bessey, who should then replace/repair etc.
I bought a phone from Dick smith, which had a fault, and the manufacturer replaced it.

Prices thus far are not cheap. I needed some 16mm MDF, so thought I'd check their pricing. $37 odd per sheet minus 10%. Bunnies: $30 odd, minus trade (not much): still at least 10% cheaper. No wonder builders never went there.
TM

[Kuffy]

I noticed this morning on ebay that one of the places I get my powertools from are charging $450-500 for a triton router JOF001 MOF001 TRA001. The price seems to have skyrocketed because it wasn't so long ago that they were ~$280-350. I do note that timberbits still has the MOF001 for $350 and TRA001 for $420. I considered buying a spare MOF001 for about $320 at masters but bought the oscillating spindle sander instead for cheap at $224. If it breaks, I will just call triton and they will probably tell me to take it to their repairman or an agent which will then send it to the repairman.

It was busy at Masters this morning. It was "almost" as busy as Bunnings on any given Monday morning....almost :D
And the staff actually stopped to ask whether I needed any assistance. that shouldn't have been a surprise, but it was very far from the normal over the last couple of years.

[NathanaelBC]

I believe that manufacturers' warranties still apply, ie if your bessey clamp breaks, you should be able to return it to bessey, who should then replace/repair etc.

Perhaps, but a) Shipping Bessy clamps back to North America would be prohibitively expensive; and b) the manufacturer doesn't have to comply with Australian consumer law seeing they didn't sell the product here and have no presence in Australia. It's much more convenient to drop it back at your local brick & mortar and get an immediate refund.

[Mike B]

Perhaps, but a) Shipping Bessy clamps back to North America would be prohibitively expensive; and b) the manufacturer doesn't have to comply with Australian consumer law seeing they didn't sell the product here and have no presence in Australia.

So much incorrect information here. Products bought and sold in Australia are covered under the Aus Consumer Guarantee. It might be slightly more hassle to deal with manufacturers or distributors but the fact remains you are protected. Bessey is a German company but intl shipping is irrelevant as Bessey's Australian distributor is Horden & Co.

[chris0375]

This comes down to the specifics of the company. If masters themselves bought them from an Australian supplier consumer law would apply. If masters bought them directly from the USA it gets a lot more confusing.

[NathanaelBC]

A manufacturer includes a person or businessthat makes or puts goods together, or has theirname or brand on the goods. A manufactureralso includes a person who imports goodsinto Australia, where the maker of the goodsdoes not have an office in Australia. Inthese circumstances, the importer bears theresponsibilities of the manufacturer for thepurposes of the consumer guarantees regime.

http://consumerlaw-staging.tspace.gov.au/files/2016/05/0553FT_ACL-guides_Guarantees_web.pdf

So yes, if Masters sourced from a local an Australian distributor then you can seek remediation from that person or organisation under ACL. But if Masters were the importer then you're screwed.

[Sturdee]

So much incorrect information here. Products bought and sold in Australia are covered under the Aus Consumer Guarantee.

According to Masters website (www.masters.com.au/diy-projects-ideas/support-help/masters-news) Woolworth will continue to honour all warranty's, etc, until the stores close and then setup a new entity to deal with further warranty claim.


Peter.

[Handyjack]

I have been disappointed too often in the past to make a farewell trip to Masters. More satisfaction driving past them to Bunnings where I am likely to get what I went in for.

[Toymaker Len]

Oops, i completely missed the 'masters no more thread' with three pages of similar stories and much more detailed information on how this whole debacle has developed. By the way there was one good deal in Masters which was the 500g gram 'black finishing wax' for about $20. I've just bought 200g over the net for $25.
As for Fair Trading I am sure they are across this stuff but will they take any action? probably not...budget cuts.

[rrich]

You encountered two GOOB tactics.

First, advertise "10% off everyday. 10% today, plus another 10% tomorrow, . . . ."

Somewhere around 30% off and in the middle of the night most of the good merchandise is removed and replaced with junk that hasn't sold in the last six or eight GOOB sales run by the liquidator. Usually it is the kind of junk that you wouldn't buy at 95% off.

Second, entire stock sold to a liquidator. The liquidator comes in during the night, raises all the prices to about 20% over MSRP or full retail price. Then they "discount" everything 10%. The liquidator will operate the store for, at the most, another month. (Depending upon the lease and what part has been paid by the GOOB.) Then the store is gone, closed forever. The liquidator will allow any and all advertising to run under the GOOB name. Yes, false advertising but the store isn't in the GOOB name anymore. It doesn't matter what the sign on the building says. You don't even get so much as a F Y very much.

The terms here:
MSRP - Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price (Mainly applies to vehicles but an accurate description)
GOOB - Going Out Of Business

[rrich]

I encountered a similar situation when Circuit City went out of business.

We needed a printer. CC had one on sale for 50% off, but it was in their GOOB newspaper advertisement.

At CC I find a printer, put it in a shopping cart and go to check out.
The clerk rings the printer at 10% above MSRP.
I object. The clerk says "That's the price."
I say this is the newspaper ad. The clerk says, "We are mumble, mumble name. We don't honor any CC advertising."
I say the sign on your building . . The clerk says, "We are mumble, mumble name."
People in line behind me are getting irritated. I look at the clerk and say, "Put it back on the shelf." Then I leave.

I went a few doors down and asked what Staples could do on the printer. They matched the price AND loaded the printer in my pickup truck for me. :U

There are sleaze and even more sleaze but the GOOB liquidators are the ultimate in sleaze.

[ailmik]

Just my experience. I went in to buy some 100litre storage boxes off Masters on Monday (have bought them before and needed a five more). Shelf price was something like $33 no discount listed. I didn't care too much about the price as I needed them anyway. Got to the checkout and scanned them out, roughly $10 off each box. Bonus

[Simplicity]

This will be interesting to see

https://www.facebook.com/realcommercial/posts/1038083329623094

[Simplicity]

And now this

https://www.facebook.com/realcommercial/posts/1038083329623094

[China]

I was not having a go the regulator I just know how long the process takes as for Woolies Masters would be a separate company and I very much doubt that Woolies will have guaranteed liability

[crowie]

This will be interesting to see

https://www.facebook.com/realcommercial/posts/1038083329623094


Chinese trying to purchase more of Australia????

[Simplicity]

Chinese trying to purchase more of Australia????

More to the point
You can rest assure what ever you buy there will be 100 percent Chinese made.

[FenceFurniture]

Chinese trying to purchase more of Australia????:no: Chinese wanting Australia to purchase more Chinese.

[aldav]

I'd be very surprised if Masters were sourcing their Bessey products through Horden & Co. The huge discrepancy in prices between Masters and other outlets carrying these products is a pretty fair indicator that Masters had a much more direct path to the factory.

When left without any effective competition Bunnings offer a very second rate service and buying experience. It would have been nice to be able to experience Masters on more than a very occasional basis without having to make a 3 hour round trip before they pulled the pin. Being in the situation of having no alternative to Bunnings in the general hardware field constantly encourages me to support the local tool specialists, timber suppliers and fastener specialists in the area. If I'm unable to get what I want at those local specialists and am unhappy with either the price or choice at Bunnings I order online. Recently I bought 1,000 SS decking screws and a P & N countersink tool at a 38% saving (delivered) on the price for the same thing at Bunnings. Sorry, that's not strictly true, the screws I bought weren't branded 'Zenith'.

Almost any business competing with Bunnings should be encouraged at every opportunity. Believe me it is a sad situation when there is no alternative.

[FenceFurniture]

Being in the situation of having no alternative to Bunnings in the general hardware field constantly encourages me to support the local tool specialists, timber suppliers and fastener specialists in the area. If I'm unable to get what I want at those local specialists and am unhappy with either the price or choice at Bunnings I order online.LOOGXERRY! All I have is Home Hardware, and no local specialists - if you think Bunnings are useless.......

[aldav]

LOOGXERRY! All I have is Home Hardware, and no local specialists - if you think Bunnings are useless.......


You have my absolute sympathy FenceFurniture! But believe me when there is no effective competition Bunnings are absolutely terrible. As stated by others, getting to the checkout to hand over your hard earned is more often than not the most painful part of the process - no checkouts open, all business conducted at the returns counter, queue a mile long and all the other staff wandering around like farts in a bottle. The only station that you can guarantee will be manned at Bunnings is the anti-theft, sorry, meet and greet, at the front of the store.

Having quite a number of family in the mountains between Springwood and Blackheath I can certainly understand your frustration though. If a Bunnings did open at Katoomba it would more than likely wipe out your Home Hardware in pretty short order and you would be back to square one, albeit with a larger range of products.

[crowie]

I was at Masters again today to buy a couple of Bessey Clamps, impressive seeing cars in the carpark on such a damp day and a good number of folk inside.
Didn't bother with anything else as I just wanted to get home BUT did notice a "visitor" adding "Closing Down" & "Going Out of Business" signage everywhere....

It's a crying shame that Bunnings only lifted there game once competition was knocking....the old BBC was half decent in comparison, IMHO......
We need competition and diversity in all industries especially hardware.....

[NathanaelBC]

Thankfully the Internet has helped with market diversity - you are now no longer restricted to shops within x miles radius of home or work; but sometimes you just want to walk into a shop with a bolt and try out a bunch of nuts to make sure you get the right one, or get a feel for the ergonomics of a power tool before buying. If I'd had the opportunity to play with my Triton TRA001 before I bought it (online) I may not have got it, it feels too top heavy with the handles up high. Or screwdrivers, or trying to hack together some weird contraption from PVC pipe, dowel, aluminium bar and irrigation pipe ... as I've spent hours in Bunnings doing.

[Twisted Tenon]

I called in the Masters at West Gosford this morning. The car park was full and the traffic was in gridlock along Manns Road. I could see nothing under 10% off and a lot of people wandering about with nothing in their hands. I wanted to get a 5ltr bottle of Titebond, sold out of course. :p

TT

[FenceFurniture]

impressive seeing cars in the carpark on such a damp day and a good number of folk inside.But that's the problem Peter - lot's of cars, lots of people - empty handed. Have a look at the video in the news article you sent me. The number of people coming out with a trolley (or a bag) is a joke.

Lot's of cars driving past though......

I went again yesterday to get the other stuff I should have purchased on Monday (DOH!). 10% off stuff I have an immediate need for is ok. There were stacks more people there but funnily enough I could walk straight up to a cash register, even though there were only 2-3 open......

[justonething]

Went in the Hawthorn store today. I saw a couple of people holding closing down sale sign at the freeway exit. In side the store it was busy, but it wasn't packed like a real closing down sale though. Saw a can of Bulls eye Shellac that was made in 2016 Feb (After I read an article on how to decode the Zinsser manufacture coding (https://woodworkersedge.wordpress.com/2012/07/15/decode-your-shellac/)) so I bought that and a few other things that is nice to have like a Bessey clamp, a japanese pull saw blade and a Kobalt plane blade. I notice on the receipts that trade discount no longer applies. Agree that I've seen nobody buying up big while I was there.

[Bebbo]

A family member works there now to fire all the staff. They have 800mil worth of stock theyre looking to sell for 600mill.

So dont expect huge discounts along the whole stock range.

One stores usually turns over 300k a week and is over 1mill already. So the stock is going its just not crazy cheap yet.

Also there is no defined end date. Its just when each store clears enough stock to close. Them the stock moves to one of the busier stores.

Sent from my LG-H815 using Tapatalk

[bueller]

A family member works there now to fire all the staff. They have 800mil worth of stock theyre looking to sell for 600mill.


Ha! Good luck with that.

[FenceFurniture]

Then the stock moves to one of the busier stores. I didn't know there were any....

[Bebbo]

I didn't know there were any....
Hahaha apparently so

[aarggh]

The clan and I passed a Masters on the way to Sunday brunch today, and on all the corners they had young staff standing holding a shutting down sale sign.

The poor buggers looked so morose, and while a lot of times in jobs you have to do things you may not enjoy or like, I thought it was particularly distasteful and demeaning to the staff especially given the circumstances.

Just really put me off even considering going to Masters for anything!

cheers, Ian

[I_wanna_Shed]

The clan and I passed a Masters on the way to Sunday brunch today, and on all the corners they had young staff standing holding a shutting down sale sign.

The poor buggers looked so morose, and while a lot of times in jobs you have to do things you may not enjoy or like, I thought it was particularly distasteful and demeaning to the staff especially given the circumstances.

Just really put me off even considering going to Masters for anything!

cheers, Ian

Yes, I think it's the ways of the organisation brought in to close them down. The large banners on the stores saying "GOING OUT OF BUSINESS" don't attract customers as much as "CLEARANCE SALE" would.

[Bohdan]

But 10% off doesn't qualify as a "CLEARANCE SALE" so they were in fact being truthful.

[Geebung]

I wandered around Masters last Saturday. I don't consider 10% really that good a deal unless you are in need of 1000's of dollars worth of equipment. The 30% discount was only on fixings such as screws etc. Bunnings appears to have a better selection for fixings but it seems to me that both stock inferior quality screws etc. I can't tell you how many times I have torn the head off a screw I bought from Bunnings...Zenith brand usually, they must make them out of pig iron. They do stock some quality power tools, but again, 10% is not a great deal unless you are buying some really expensive stuff and are in dire need of such a tool.

As to Masters vs Bunnings - I have always had a love hate relationship - I love hardware, but I hate going to either store. I have only recently discovered Timbecon (also began life in WA like Bunnings) - I got great service there (phone, email and in-store!). I purchased a drill press and the guy threw in some drill bits - you won't get that at Bunnings!

[chris0375]

They have 800mil worth of stock theyre looking to sell for 600mill.


Is the 800 million at full retail price? They won't be getting anything like 75% of retail for most stuff. Especially not towards the end when it's all the crap left.

800 million doesn't actually sound that bad compared to dick Smith. They apparently had 100 million in EXTRA stock before they went broke.

[Bebbo]

I wandered around Masters last Saturday. I don't consider 10% really that good a deal unless you are in need of 1000's of dollars worth of equipment. The 30% discount was only on fixings such as screws etc. Bunnings appears to have a better selection for fixings but it seems to me that both stock inferior quality screws etc. I can't tell you how many times I have torn the head off a screw I bought from Bunnings...Zenith brand usually, they must make them out of pig iron. They do stock some quality power tools, but again, 10% is not a great deal unless you are buying some really expensive stuff and are in dire need of such a tool.

As to Masters vs Bunnings - I have always had a love hate relationship - I love hardware, but I hate going to either store. I have only recently discovered Timbecon (also began life in WA like Bunnings) - I got great service there (phone, email and in-store!). I purchased a drill press and the guy threw in some drill bits - you won't get that at Bunnings!
Bunnings is an expensive place to buy fixings from anyway. 30% would still be more then i pay for off several fastener mobs anyway

Sent from my LG-H815 using Tapatalk

[Geebung]

Where do you get your fixings from Bebbo?

[chris0375]

Just got back from masters. I screenshot prices of some dar primed timber earlier in the week. It was less than half price. Go to the store today and it was about 30% more expensive than advertised. Apparently prices are updated every Wednesday. I was extremely off. It wasn't much money but the principle. They can die a painful death as far as I am concerned.

It's price baiting. Probably not illegal but very disrespectful. No store having a closing date sale should be raising prices.

[bueller]

Just got back from masters. I screenshot prices of some dar primed timber earlier in the week. It was less than half price. Go to the store today and it was about 30% more expensive than advertised. Apparently prices are updated every Wednesday. I was extremely off. It wasn't much money but the principle. They can die a painful death as far as I am concerned.

It's price baiting. Probably not illegal but very disrespectful. No store having a closing date sale should be raising prices.
Haha whoever is in charge of administration is a fool. They're going to sit on stock forever while having to keep staff on the books, then eventually drop the price to the level they should have started with anyway.

[crowie]

Just a side issue on Masters Closing Down....

Today I dropped in to see an old mate who works there and while I was waiting for him to finish serving a customer I asked the lass on the counter how she was and how things have been going with the sale.
Well I'd spoken with this lass before and she's quite a good kid but what she said nearly floored me.
The customers have been taking there frustrations about masters and the close down on the staff giving them some awful grief and in some cases abuse.
I was discussed and could only chat with her trying to encourage her.

PLEASE folk, don't take out frustration upon staff who are more than likely loosing the jobs.
Cheers, crowie

[aarggh]

Haha whoever is in charge of administration is a fool. They're going to sit on stock forever while having to keep staff on the books, then eventually drop the price to the level they should have started with anyway.

As per usual I reckon you'll find the "fools in charge" will receive their bonuses and golden payouts regardless of any outcome!

[Shedhand]

I went into Mornington Masters last week. Attracted by tv ad declari g massive savings blah blah. The only things reduced more than 10% was the exorbitantly priced imported American red oak and poplar. I never saw anything else priced less than 10% off. And they were still dearer than Bunnings. I commented on this to a staff member and he said discounts would increase as closure in December got nearer. Yeah, right! When only useless crap is left. Like plastic brush n pan sets.

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[Shedhand]

I got a giggle out of the video.

There was a comment that was notable:

Lowes didn't understand the Australian market. The comment about snow shovels in summer was hysterical. Lowes is headquartered in Charlotte, North Carolina. The fact that your seasons and our seasons are reversed was lost on Lowes.

Remember with all of their training, a Lowes manager can manage anyone, anywhere, anytime without having to know what they are managing. I can substitute several company names for Lowes based upon personal experience. LOL!

Here in the US, Sears attempted to move into the home center business. Sears acquired Orchard Supply Hardware, a small supply house oriented about the wine industry in the Napa Valley and in reality a very good hardware chain. Sears changed the name to OSH and acquired a lot of sites. Sears headquartered in Chicago managed the stock and the store layout including shelf space arrangements.

SWMBO wanted to walk through the OSH in Huntington Beach when the store first opened. As we were walking through the store, she starts giggling. I asked her, "What are you laughing at?" SWMBO points and says, "Those are sump pumps, aren't they?" Yes, there was about 2 M of shelf space dedicated to displaying 6 or 8 different models of sump pumps. Her astute observation was, "They aren't going to stay in business very long."

In Huntington Beach, except for a few multistory commercial buildings, there are probably less than 10 basements in the city. All the houses are built on either a slab or a half meter crawl space. In my neighborhood the water table is 1.5 M which makes a basement almost impossible.
I worked in a Timber and hardware retail outlet in the early 1980s just when DIY was taking off in a big way. If anyone with a brain and some commonsense at Woolworths would listen i could tell them where they went so seriously wrong. I watched, from day one, the slide to oblivion. Everythong from staff, product knowledge, product range, pricing, service and location. It was all wrong. Im not surprised they failed.

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[Bendigo Bob]

First time i walked into a Masters, was impressed with how 'showy' it was, but disappointed to overhear two staff conversations bitching about bosses. Went away thinking 'something's wrong here????

I guess success and failure start at the top. If you can't motivate staff you will never succeed.

[aarggh]

I always found the staff at the Keysborough branch really good, but I never liked going there as it felt like walking into a morgue. Always dead and barely a person in sight any time I went.

I passed one last week and needed some concrete, so thought I'd pull in, but it seemed everyone else in Melb had the same idea, not a parking spot to be seen. So I drove out and went to Bunnings.