ANZ Bank can go to hell

[Wongo]

My niece, who is an overseas study, has an account with ANZ. This is what happened to her,

05/09/2013 - found a payment in her statement saying "Payment to Telstra 2484500276". The amount was $401.42. This is strange because she is no a Telstra customer and has no association with Telstra.

11/09/2013 - we went to ANZ. They said they would investigate and stop any further direct debit from her account

18/09/2013 - received a letter from ANZ. "We wish to advise that in regards to your enquiry for $401.42, we have been informed by Westpac Banking Corporation, that the debit user has not provided an authority form. If you wish to request for a refund please contact us on 131314...."

23/09/2013 - another payment to Telstra but this time it was $1522.58.

26/09/2013 - went to ANZ. #@@#$%^&**:~

02/10/2013 - was told that ANZ won't refund money because Telstra refused to give the money back.


Feeling angry and quite helpless actually. Might have to contact fair trading and find a lawyer.

Any thoughts?

[david.elliott]

is that Telstra have her account details.
Although I suspect we may see more of these errors occurring as it only takes 1 number incorrect in a multi digit BSB and account number to debit the wrong account.
We have in the past (though not for the same reason) had dealings with both the Telecommunications Ombudsman, Telecommunications Industry Ombudsman - TIO (http://www.tio.com.au/)
and the Banking Ombudsman, Financial Ombudsman Service (http://www.fos.org.au/centric/home_page.jsp)
and they have both been great to deal with and got things fixed.

My concern is that you may get pushed between the two saying the other is at fault, so I would lodge a complaint with both concurrently. In the meantime close the account and move whatever funds are there somewhere else otherwise I guarantee it will happen again!
One thing some people are unaware of is that once you sign the paper to allow direct debit only the debitor? can stop the payment, you cannot!

[FenceFurniture]

Telstra must know to which account the funds were applied.

[rwbuild]

My niece, who is an overseas study, has an account with ANZ. This is what happened to her,

05/09/2013 - found a payment in her statement saying "Payment to Telstra 2484500276". The amount was $401.42. This is strange because she is no a Telstra customer and has no association with Telstra.

11/09/2013 - we went to ANZ. They said they would investigate and stop any further direct debit from her account

18/09/2013 - received a letter from ANZ. "We wish to advise that in regards to your enquiry for $401.42, we have been informed by Westpac Banking Corporation, that the debit user has not provided an authority form. If you wish to request for a refund please contact us on 131314...."

23/09/2013 - another payment to Telstra but this time it was $1522.58.

26/09/2013 - went to ANZ. #@@#$%^&**:~

Banking ombudsman
02/10/2013 - was told that ANZ won't refund money because Telstra refused to give the money back.


Feeling angry and quite helpless actually. Might have to contact fair trading and find a lawyer.

Any thoughts?

Banking ombudsman, thats what their there for

[Wongo]

We went to Telstra but they could not help. She is no a customer so they do not have any information about her. The payment number on the statement didn't get us anywhere.

[Wongo]

Banking ombudsman, thats what their there for


Thanks for that mate.

[FenceFurniture]

They can help, but just won't because you are not the ANZ or Telstra acount holder. It would appear to be a criminal matter so I'd go to the police. They have the powers to get the info from Telstra. You may need to organise a Power of Attorney so that you can act on her behalf.

[Sturdee]

You may need to organise a Power of Attorney so that you can act on her behalf.

Spot on.

Until you have a power of attorney or are organised as a signatory to your niece's bank account you can complain as much as you like but it's like p*****g in the wind. You have no legal authority to act and privacy legislation stops them doing anything.

So get an authority to act or use a solicitor.

Peter.

[wheelinround]

Close her account with ANZ for starters.

[Wongo]

My feeling is that it has nothing to do with Telstra. It could be a criminal act. We are going in again this afternoon and take all money out of her account. I really want to go to the police. Do you think they can help?

[CMB]

I think you may need to close it outright. If emptied only, direct debits can still be taken out and put the account in debit.

Craig.

[Gra]

My feeling is that it has nothing to do with Telstra. It could be a criminal act. We are going in again this afternoon and take all money out of her account. I really want to go to the police. Do you think they can help?

Police will say its a private matter between you and the bank. unless you can prove it was fraud and not incompetence.

As has been posted elswere, talk to the managers, manager and keep flowing up the food chain until you find someone who gives a @#$%, this is from an employee at one of the competitors.

[FenceFurniture]

My feeling is that it has nothing to do with Telstra. No, that's right, they are just receiving and accepting the money. But it has to be applied to a Telstra account, and they will obviously know which account it was applied to. Curious that there would be two in two weeks though.

It could be a criminal act. Can't see it as anything else, personally.

We are going in again this afternoon and take all money out of her account. Surely if you have authority to do that then you have authority to close the account, which would follow on to having the authority to be given information?

I really want to go to the police. Do you think they can help? Only one way to find out. Solicitors charge "rather a lot" per hour - Police are free, and if there is a criminal case then they will also take it to court for you, essentially acting on your behalf.

The point is that somebody has set up this direct debit - the bank should know who that was (although it was probably done on the Net, but still....), and Telstra has applied those funds to some account. I'd hazard a guess to say find the Telstra account holder and you'll probably find the perp.

[Big Shed]

Closing the ANZ account may not be the best option.

At the moment she is a customer and as such the bank should have to listen to her complaint, if the account was closed she is no longer a customer and therefore the bank is even less likely to take notice of her complaint.

I think Gra's advice is very good, keep going up the food chain.

A registered letter to ANZ setting out the case so far and advice that the matter will be referred to the banking ombudsman wouldn't hurt either.

Verbal complaints are easy to ignore, complaints in writing via registered letter are a tad harder to ignore.

[Gra]

The point is that somebody has set up this direct debit - the bank should know who that was (although it was probably done on the Net, but still....), and Telstra has applied those funds to some account. I'd hazard a guess to say find the Telstra account holder and you'll probably find the perp.

The direct debi, may not have been set up with the bank, but with Telstra, so the bank may not know who set it up, they just got an electronic feed from Telstra to debit account no XXX.

Wongo's problem here seem to be finding someone who gives a @$%, hence my sugesstion of going up the food chain until you find someone who does. I guarantee you a call from the regional manager to a branch gets things done real quick

[david.elliott]

maybe close that account, and move to another ANZ account.

At the moment she is a customer and as such the bank should have to listen to her complaint, if the account was closed she is no longer a customer and therefore the bank is even less likely to take notice of her complaint.

I think Gra's advice is very good, keep going up the food chain.

A registered letter to ANZ setting out the case so far and advice that the matter will be referred to the banking ombudsman wouldn't hurt either.

Verbal complaints are easy to ignore, complaints in writing via registered letter are a tad harder to ignore.[/QUOTE]

[Chesand]

A letter straight to the attention of the Managing Director or CEO is often quicker than working up the food chain. Backsides then get kicked on the way down.
A few years ago I was having a problem with Qantas over lost luggage. Everyone was passing the buck but a letter to the then CEO brought a response within two days and resolution very quickly.

[Toymaker Len]

Don't wait Wongo go to the police and the ombudsman and the CEO. Write letters to all with the details and demand an interview. The information is in the system to solve the problem but the employees you have seen so far are just too lazy/ignorant to do anything about it. They probably think 'Ah well she's just a student... what can she do ?'

[FenceFurniture]

Yes, I think Chesand and Toymaker Len are right on the money there - multiple approach, and call them off when it's resolved by one of them.

You'd be surprised how little time the CEO will want to spend on this when he's knows the Police and the Ombudsman are going to be involved. Given that his hourly rate is over a $grand (and that's at 80 hours per week) the less time time he and his staff spend on satisfying you the better (it may even be worthwhile pointing that out to him).

You may be able to work out his email address - once you have the email addy for another staff member then just play around with the combo. I think it's still Mike Smith who is the CEO, but Google can confirm that. If you can get his address right then it will expedite the matter, I would think.

Of all the businesses, you can bet that the banks are the best at making commercial decisions.

Noise, noise, and more noise - squeaky hinge syndrome.

[FenceFurniture]

Btw, it may be worth mentioning to any ANZ staffer that you're dealing with: "Would you like to be the one to answer to Mike Smith as to why this took so long to resolve and cost the bank so much time = money?" It may give them a little extra incentive to get things moving instead of stonewalling.

[Trav]

If you or your niece are social media savvy, you might think of tweeting about this to ANZ and Telstra. They have people keenly looking in huge twittosphere for this kind of thing. If they start looking bad in front of others, then they might take notice. Don't be defamatory, but make it clear that neither are listening.

Trav

[rustynail]

Some years back, I had a business account with ANZ. The arrangement was that cheques paid to either my name or the company name could be deposited. The bank decided to dishonour some cheques I had written, due to insufficient funds. Upon contacting the bank and speaking to the manager, I was advised that some cheques I had deposited, made out to my name, had not been placed in the account and had been posted back to me with an explanation. When I asked why, I was told this was at the new manager"s discretion. I made an appointment to see the manager the following day. He refused to budge, so I asked for my account to be closed and the funds handed to me in cash. He said that was not possible on the spot and could i give him a little time. I agreed to an hour and would be back for the money. My wife and I went to lunch. After an hour, I pulled up at the bank and sent the wife in for the money. She returned with the cash. Ten minutes later, I went in, asked to see the manager as he was expecting me. The manager came to the counter and ushered me into his office. When I asked for the cash he said my wife had it. I said, "Who?" He said, "Your wife, she just left, about ten minutes ago." I said, "Well that's bloody interesting, she is visiting her mother in Sydney today." This was correct as the visit was to be later that day. Knowing full well the manager had never met my wife before, I asked, "How did you know this person was my wife?" "She said so," was the worried reply. I just raised an eyebrow and looked at him, waiting for his next bright idea. You have never seen a bloke look more uncomfortable. "What does your wife look like?" He asked. " To me, El McPherson," was my reply. This piece of information afforded him no assistance what so ever. "I need to contact the police," says he. "And I need to speak to your boss," Says I. "But first I need my money, as that was the purpose of the visit. Or should I wait until you have a clearance from your superiors to make a double payment, because that was what you will be doing?" At this stage the poor fellow didnt know what to do. All colour had drained from his face and his hands had begun to shake.
I said, "Look, lets just let bye gones be bye gones. What about my wife and I open a joint account so these troublesome cheques have some where to go? And hopefully, the person who off with the cash, has a pang of conscience and comes back with the dosh." This was agreed to. I went and collected my wife from the car, to come and sign for the new account. The account was opened with the funds she had collected a little earlier in the day.
The manager, if about, always comes and shakes my hand, with a "good to see you, good to see you."
I dont think he means a single word of it.

Dont close your account. A closed account and you no longer exist.

[FenceFurniture]

A closed account and you no longer exist.And we do, with an open account?

Good yarn Ken.

[rustynail]

And we do, with an open account?

Good yarn Ken.
Well at least on paper we do.

[wheelinround]

Scott why can't the bank put a halt to the funds deduction at customers request??

We have done this over the phone not with ANZ tho. I refuse to ever use them.

Biggest thing I see is where's Telstra in all this seems your dealing with two companies not one for fraud.?????

Media have a field day with Telstra there's always Whirlpool.com it seems to get things fixed.

[Handyjack]

Closing the ANZ account may not be the best option.

At the moment she is a customer and as such the bank should have to listen to her complaint, if the account was closed she is no longer a customer and therefore the bank is even less likely to take notice of her complaint.

I think Gra's advice is very good, keep going up the food chain.

A registered letter to ANZ setting out the case so far and advice that the matter will be referred to the banking ombudsman wouldn't hurt either.

Verbal complaints are easy to ignore, complaints in writing via registered letter are a tad harder to ignore.

Close the account, but open another. The basis being that you are changing account numbers to prevent unauthorised transaction.
Keep persisting and hopefully all will be good and the money returned.

[jarradds123]

As someone who works in the banking industry I would recommend:
-requesting ANZ to stop all debits from Telstra out of the account (assuming you are a signatory), they are required to do this within a reasonable time frame(processing of the form). Request a copy of the form you complete for this.
-do not close the account and open a new one. Simply because you shouldn't have to and it will make it difficult for your niece overseas.
-make a disputed transaction claim for lost funds.
-make a complaint. This could simply be made by ringing the call centre, all banks have a time frame they need to acknowledge and respond to the complaint in. They will give ombudsman details in their response if it is not favorable.

I believe you will find they will pay out then seek reimbursement from Telstra. Personally I have never liked their service, I think the staff you have dealt with haven't followed procedure.

Good luck

[Wongo]

She got her money back today. It has taken almost 5 weeks and I wasn't impressed at all. I told her to take all the money out and stay away from ANZ.

Thanks everyone for the inputs, and to those who were kind enough to offer help through PMs. Its such a relief.