Spray Finish for Pine Entertainment Unit

[Gazza]

Hi,
I have just finished my first major project, an Entertainment unit that spans the complete width of our lounge room.

It was constructed from pine offcuts that I scrounged from building sites.

I want a Baltic Pine type finish that maybe I could spray on.
I previously build my wife a kitchen centre that I finished in a Poly Cabots product with a Baltic stain in it, applied by brush. The problem was, it was not dark enough and the drying time was slow so dust settled a lot.

I have been told then most stains, finished in profession shops are sprayed on Laquer that have a very short drying time so dust settleing is not so much of a problem.

Can anyone suggest a suitable product, also any information on spraying laquers, etc would be appreciated.

[PaulS]

Gazza,

About Staining, I tried the combined poly and stain and wouldn't use it again. If you don't/can't spray, then I reckon the feast watson baltic stain would be the way to go. You can just keep adding coats until you are happy with the colour. (they also suggest putting the fungishield on under it to give an even colour).
You might also try the Minwax wipe on poly (at bunnings) which gives a pretty good finish and there are no brush marks..


Paul

[Gazza]

Gazza,
If you don't/can't spray, then I reckon the feast watson baltic stain would be the way to go. Paul

Actually I would like to give spraying a go but don't know what to use or where to buy it. I have heard that sprayed on laquers dry very quickly, is this true ?

[Harry72]

Just use the cabots normal poly(carbothane) and use the country baltic water based stain(also cabots). You wont get a good shine out of quick drying lacquers, unless its buffed after curring fully.
All polys take hours to touch dry, you need to paint in a clean area that has no dust, make up a temporary booth out of plastic drop sheets and wear a good resipator while in it... and on flat top surfaces on the last coat aboslutely flood it on for a very deep shine without brush marks, just make sure its level first...
To spray a poly finish you need too treat it like an enamel automotive paint.

[RETIRED]

Just use the cabots normal poly(carbothane) and use the country baltic water based stain(also cabots). You wont get a good shine out of quick drying lacquers, unless its buffed after curring fully.

EH????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

[Harry72]

Well every time I've used lac its never come out with the shine that poly is capable off straight off the gun...

[RETIRED]

I use Wattyl Isogard 95 and you could use it for a mirror. 2 coats.

Not my preference but women like it and thems the ones paying. :) .

I prefer 30 myself.

[Gazza]

I use Wattyl Isogard 95 and you could use it for a mirror. 2 coats.

Not my preference but women like it and thems the ones paying. :) .

I prefer 30 myself.

Actually I am not after a mirror shine, I prefer a satin type sheen, which I have been told by a local cabinet maker that is best acheived by spraying laquer.

, you sound like you are right into spraying. The Wattyl 95 and 30 you mention above, are they laquers ???
Are they suitable for spraying onto Pine ?
Do you need any special surface preparation ?
Other than a spray gun of course do you need any special equipment ?
Is it something that a complete novice could use and still achieve a reasonable finish ?
I have checked at Bunnings and they don't carry the Wattyl 95 or 30, where can it be purchased from ?

[echnidna]

Just use the cabots normal poly(carbothane) and use the country baltic water based stain(also cabots). You wont get a good shine out of quick drying lacquers, unless its buffed after curring fully.
All polys take hours to touch dry, you need to paint in a clean area that has no dust, make up a temporary booth out of plastic drop sheets and wear a good resipator while in it... and on flat top surfaces on the last coat aboslutely flood it on for a very deep shine without brush marks, just make sure its level first...
To spray a poly finish you need too treat it like an enamel automotive paint.

A good furniture polisher can lay lacquer on so it doesnt need cut and polish. Furniture lacquer is a little more forgiving than Auto lacquer though its near enough the same thing. I'm not in the class of a pro polisher but my lacquer jobs don't need buffing.

[RETIRED]

, you sound like you are right into spraying. If it doesn't come out of a gun it goes out of our place unfinished. :D

The Wattyl 95 and 30 you mention above, are they laquers ???Yep, nitro cellulose lacquers.

Are they suitable for spraying onto Pine ? Yep.

Other than a spray gun of course do you need any special equipment ?A very very good compressor if you are doing large surfaces. Water traps help too.

Is it something that a complete novice could use and still achieve a reasonable finish ? With practise.

I have checked at Bunnings and they don't carry the Wattyl 95 or 30, where can it be purchased from ? All good paint stores carry it but it is only available in 20 Litre drums.

You might like to look here,

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=485

And here:

http://www.cjohnhebert.com/spraying.htm

[Harry72]

A good furniture polisher can lay lacquer on so it doesnt need cut and polish. Furniture lacquer is a little more forgiving than Auto lacquer though its near enough the same thing. I'm not in the class of a pro polisher but my lacquer jobs don't need buffing. Well I've never seen a lac with "a real deep shine" that hasnt been polished/buffed and had extreme amounts of coats.
When I say shine I mean like freshly buffed clear over base black 2pac, or even a baked enamel.

, I dont think you need that good'a compressor, long as it has a reasonable sized tank(to stop plusing)and no less that 10cfm. Many people run into trouble because they run their guns with to much pressure... thats when the comp wont keep up and you waste heaps of paint with overspray. With polys Im only running around 15psi.
Running air tools is when you need a big 20cfm bastard.

[Cliff Rogers]

Well I've never seen a lac with "a real deep shine" that hasnt been polished/buffed and had extreme amounts of coats.
When I say shine I mean like freshly buffed clear over base black 2pac, or even a baked enamel......Hey Harry, when you say "lac" are you talking about nitro cellulose lacquers like the stuff used on wood or something you've used/seen to paint cars?

I did a custom art course using auto paints about 25 years ago & back then EVERYTHING was buffed including the 'clear.'

[Harry72]

Cliff, both!
Im getting close to good quality car paint just with everyday carbothane, I wouldnt waste time with lac unless a low sheen is needed.
You dont buff enamel it kills the surface, unless its old and faded and on its last legs.
Anyway were gettin of course, Gazza only wants a low sheen so lac is the answer, cant say I've used low sheen poly... anyone?

[Tasman]

Here in Tassie i use a product made by sherwood,i think it is made in Victoria,it spays very well and drying time is very short,i always use 30% gloss and to get a realy glossy finish i use the french polishing method with a rubber made from a lint free cloth with cotton wool inside it,dip it in striaght thinners and rub with long strokes but only do it when touch dry then you can drag the polish to fill small grain then finish with another spray coat.........
Hope this helps..........

Reuards Tasman

[RETIRED]

, I dont think you need that good'a compressor, long as it has a reasonable sized tank(to stop plusing)and no less that 10cfm. Many people run into trouble because they run their guns with to much pressure... thats when the comp wont keep up and you waste heaps of paint with overspray. With polys Im only running around 15psi.
Running air tools is when you need a big 20cfm bastard.

I wa referring to the el cheapo type that have to run all the time even at 15PSI. :D

[Harry72]

Yeah a few mates have them useless things, one of them has had his for about 12mths the thing has lost that much compression it dont even run a stapler very well anymore...
My old clisby14 2.2hp/50l is 7-8yrs old been used nearly every day, its still Ok just starting to loose compression now. Due for an upgrade soon, I'll keep the tank for an extra auxiliry tank for a spray room maybe.
Hare&Forbes has some nice looking units, Hafco super16 2.7hp/100l would be good at only $879 or the next step up a Pilot 3hp/100l $1195 which has a 2 stage pump Im guessing around 15-16cfm, should run my windi tool well!(dual action sander)

[Gazza]

Hi everyone and thanks for your input.

I have found out that my local Carbatec store sells MIROTONE MIROCAT clear laquer in 4 litre cans, more convenient than the Wattyl 20l cans.

Has anyone used MIROCAT and give any suggestions etc...

I am also looking at buying a compressor and spray outfit, the local airtools centre has some 120cf/m compressors for around $150 and 150cf/m for around $350.

They also have several types of spray guns, should I go for a standard gun or a HVLP gun ?

Should I go for a Gravity Feed gun or a Siphon gun ?

Which would be best and easiest to use for a complete novice.

I mostly want to spray laquer for cabinets, tables, etc.

Thanks

[echnidna]

My compressor is a chinese thing about 8 years old with 1.5 hp and I have sprayed a lot of furniture with it. Its done a lot more work than I expected a cheap unit to do.

I prefer a gravity feed gun but just use a hp siphon gun these days.

As well as the lacquer get some (compatible) sanding sealer as well for the first coat, much easier and a better finish than using lacquer all the way.

[Harry72]

Gaza spend a few dollars on a compressor, once you've had one for a while you'll realize they are very handy to have. Those ultra cheaps are not real flash, ok if you only use it a couple times a year for small batch spraying(e.g. not several big cabinets at once) with a touch up gun.
There are so many tools that can be run off a comp, for instance I find a rattle gun is a savior if you like to keep your car wheels/mags detailed(I got 15spokers...) or got any hard bolts.

With spray guns just like the compressor spend the dollars and save the heart ache, decent guns atomise(make finer droplets)the paint way better than cheapys thus giving a smoother flat coat, especially on the final coat this can be critical.
Syphon feed or gravity feed is a personal preference, both have advantages,
Gravity feed are good for flat horizontal surfaces the pot is vertical while spraying at a dowards angle like table tops, disadvantages the pot is usually small(500ml max) and all the weight is unbalanced above your wrist, when spraying under things like cabinet shelf's the paint tends to lap against the pot lid and if the seal is a bit dodgey your gunna end up with paint everywhere...
Syphon tend to have a pot around 1lt, usually balanced well, can spray at an upwards angle. Disadvantages while spraying at downwards angles paint can lap at the breather hole in the pot's lid(I put the hole towards the rear to combat this)dripping paint all over the freshly coated surface. Also if doing a big job like a fence or a roof you can get pressure pots which can hold 10-20lt.
You can get guns that have both feeds, I have a Advanti putty gun(3mm nozzle)which has both.
I have a Sampson S90 gun which is very reasonable they're worth around $200-250ish as a complete kit(you can buy them bare, no pot etc)
As a start go to an auto cheap shop and buy one of those small cheap touch up guns, grab some paint and give it a go, best thing to do would be to buy a book on spray painting(even if its an automotive one).
A 120cfm comp for $150, don't think so 120cfm is industrial site size job... huge, more like 120lt/m!

[Gazza]

Hi all,

Well I just put a compressor & spray gun on Layby at Carbatec.

The compressor is belt driven, 15cfm, 60lt and 1.5hp I think. Cost $395

The gun is a Porter Cable HVLP Gravity Fed, with a pressure gauge connected to the bottom of the handle. Cost $195

I have decided to use the Mirotone 30 ($80/4l) and Mirotone sanding sealer ($80/4l).

The compressor and gun are a bit more than I wanted to pay but when you think about it, I have spent thousands on machinery and the finish is what everyone sees, so it makes sense to spend a bit more and get quality gear, not the best quality as that would be wasted on me. :)

When I pick them up and spray the entertainment unit (in about 4 weeks) I will finish this thread off by letting you all know how it went.