Computer...upgrade or new ?????

[macca2]

Reading some of the threads on this BB it appears there are any number of computer gurus lurking in the woodpile. :D
My question regarding my 5 year old clunker is should I upgrade it or buy a new one. :confused:
What are the chances of a "ordinary bloke" doing an upgrade or building his own computer. :eek:
Lets have it fellas.

Macca

[Zed]

buy the bits and build a new one, its not that hard... and that way you can re use some of your old gear. if you get a copy of XP SP2 its pretty much point and shoot anyway.

[silentC]

Flog the old one for $400 and buy a new one preloaded with WinXP for $1999. Save yourself the heartache. You've got better things to do with your time.

[TassieKiwi]

What C said. I picked up a Dell for home off their website with more megs than you can poke a floppy disc at (for me anyway) and also came with speakers and subwoofer, and 17" LCD screen, for $1499. And then the boss paid for it!:D


www.dell.com.au (http://www.dell.com.au)

[johna]

forget brand name computers they are a rip off.
build one up yourself.
I recently did a new computer with the following specs

Asus p4 mainboard
P4 3.2 prescott
1 gig ddr ram
200 gig sata HDD
256 meg video card
pioneer dvd burner
19" lcd screen
case
for $1990

build time took a whole 10 minutes

[silentC]

forget brand name computers they are a rip off
How do you figure that? Dennis paid $1499 for his Dell, yours cost $1990 and you had to build it yourself.

If you can build a PC from components in 10 minutes you must be a wizard. I presume you then installed an O/S? Bet that took more than 10 minutes ;)

[bitingmidge]

Or spend $1500 on a Computer (http://store.apple.com/133-622/WebObjects/australiastore.woa/80405/wo/QQ33ScE1eLaC2SjbacS3h1POo0o/1.0.11.1.0.6.29.1.1.21.3.1.1.0?42,6) instead of a hobby.

Turn it on and talk to us!

No building no loading no nuffink.

P

[silentC]

Ha ha ha, ho ho ho, hee hee hee, good one, Midge, you're such a comedian :D

[johna]

How do you figure that? Dennis paid $1499 for his Dell, yours cost $1990 and you had to build it yourself.

If you can build a PC from components in 10 minutes you must be a wizard. I presume you then installed an O/S? Bet that took more than 10 minutes ;)

ok have a look at the difference.

on dells site they have a customise option
same specs as mine
dell comes to $3630
i think John is way in front here.

yes 10 minutes to put together. I have been putting computers together for a long time so its second nature.
With a computer that fast you can install xp pr in around 20 minutes

[silentC]

OK, fair point. If you start adding options they add up. The cheap price is on the standard model obviously.

Now for the 10 minutes, not that I don't believe you can do it (I reckon it would take me longer than that to unpack everything and remove the bubble wrap) but I think it would take a newcomer considerably longer than that, assuming that they could work out what goes where. I wouldn't recommend it to someone who just wants a new PC. If you get into it at that level, then you certainly are buying a hobby like Midge says.

Also, if you have a problem, where do you turn? It's OK if you've been building PCs for years, you know what to do if things go wrong.

My original comment stands. Save yourself the heartache and buy a ready built one. Even if you go to the local computer shop and buy one from them. If it plays up, you take it back and they fix it.

[johna]

i agree with you there for newcomers to computers.
But realy they aren't hard and things can only go in one way and into its correct slot.
There are no jumbers to set on motherboards anymore so you can't set the wrong voltages or cpu values.

But yes if you are going to purchase a ready built computer go to the local store and get one built to your specs.
Brand name computers use the same parts interanly but you are paying the premium for the name, and whatever you do don't go to hardly normal to buy a computer

[journeyman Mick]

Macca,
I got a new one built and kept the old clunker. The clunker had pretty much everything stripped out/off and is used for the net. This is my firewall! If perchance I get a virus or whatever I can just wipe the hard drive without losing anything and reload the OS. I only transfer stuff from the new computer to the old one, not vice versa so there's no danger of transferring any nasties. I'ts 7.5 years old now and will need replacing some time soon, but I'll just get another new box built and swap them around so they all get bumped down one position (bottom one goes in the big green filing cabinet on wheels out the front of the house :D ).

Mick

[barnsey]

When I decided that my old clunker was about 1/2 the power to run the programs I was running I thought I get the bits for an update. ;)

Found a supplier prepared to listen to what I wanted and priced it up. From the outside in the old clunker was no longer compatible with todays technology apart from the floppy!!! :eek:

Fair dinkum - shop around and it'll not only be cheaper than all the bits but it will look schmick and you won't have to work on it in the dusty workshop coz SWMBO won't appreciate even the ten minutes that you use the dining room table to put it together. :eek:

I'll bet johna gets his bits at dealer prices which you won't. A local reliable guy will know the good deals about when you want to buy and you'll get the benefit coz he's still buying for less than you are and if it only takes him 10 minutes to do it :rolleyes: then your labour cost is 4/5 of 5/8 of squat. :o

Stop muckin around and go and buy one. :D

Jamie

For interest 17" LCD monitors at the moment can be bought under $400 at the moment, retail so again talk to someone - soon ;)

[johna]

and 19" ones for just over $600 i love computer parts, prices drop quicker than womans pants. :)

[TassieKiwi]

and 19" ones for just over $600 i love computer parts, prices drop quicker than womans pants. :)
Show me those women! Where?

http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/10/10_1_5.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZSzeb001YYAU)

[craigb]

I reckon that it comes down to how you want to spend your hobby time.

If you like pr1cking around with computers (and NOTHING ever takes 10mins EVER) then build your own.

If you want to spend your valuable time on woodwork, then do as the silent one says and buy a Dell or something.

Lets face it, the bloody things are just commodities now anyway.

my 0.02

[bitingmidge]

Oh well.... all you non-believers asked for this:

:D :D :D

On the 1st day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

Windows XP for my PC



On the 2nd day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



On the 3rd day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

3 ports not responding

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



On the 4th day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

4 sectors bad

3 ports not responding

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



On the 5th day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

5 eighty six

4 sectors bad

3 ports not responding

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



On the 6th day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

6 ints conflictin'

5 eighty six

4 sectors bad

3 ports not responding

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



On the 7th day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

7 files missin'

6 ints conflictin'

5 eighty six

4 sectors bad

3 ports not responding

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



On the 8th day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

8 Megs overflowin'

7 files missin'

6 ints conflictin'

5 eighty six

4 sectors bad

3 ports not responding

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



On the 9th day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

9 apps a crashin'

8 Megs overflowin'

7 files missin'

6 ints conflictin'

5 eighty six

4 sectors bad

3 ports not responding

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



On the 10th day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

10 modes not supported

9 apps a crashin'

8 Megs overflowin'

7 files missin'

6 ints conflictin'

5 eighty six

4 sectors bad

3 ports not responding

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



On the 11th day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

11 instructions faulty

10 modes not supported

9 apps a crashin'

8 Megs overflowin'

7 files missin'

6 ints conflictin'

5 eighty six

4 sectors bad

3 ports not responding

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



On the 12th day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

12 sound cards silent

11 instructions faulty

10 modes not supported

9 apps a crashin'

8 Megs overflowin'

7 files missin'

6 ints conflictin'

5 eighty six

4 sectors bad

3 ports not responding

2 GPFs

and Windows XP for my PC



And the drum roll begins.......



And now, the long awaited folow-up:



On the 1st day of Christmas, my true love gave to me:

A Macintosh instead of a PC



On the 2nd day of Christmas, my true love gave to...

hey wait a minute,

this thing works !!!!!



:D :D :D

P (in his flame proof suit)

[echnidna]

We had the same problem as Macca about 6 months ago.

I looked around at prices including from the reputable ebay traders.
We bought 2 boxes setup for $400 each on a buy now basis.

I didn't go for the latest ripper stuff which would have been obsolete next week anyway.
We got 2 compouters each 2.4 mhz or is it ghz? with 80gig hardrives 256memory with cdrs etc.
Not cutting edge but good reliable workhorses cheap.

The old computers are still used offline to handle various large format printers

[Daddles]

Buy a name brand and I can recomend the Dell because that's what I'm writing on right now and it hasn't given me a drama in the seven months I've owned it - a record by a long shot.

I'm a writer - I spend my life on the computer. Mine is on from 8 in the morning till midnight every day and gets worked for much of that time. It's not unusual for me to have very large files open and four to five applications working on top of the usual windows crap. So my computers have to work and work reliably.

I've had shop built computers for many years and everyone of them has had troubles, some minor, some major, but none has been solid and reliable like my Dell. I've watched friends with similar experiences. I've found that small incompatibilities can really take the fun out of computing. My last computer kept killing CD burners. I don't know why, we never did find out for sure, but something in there didn't work, and at least one of those burners was taken out to have a happy life in another computer. Another of my old boxes, the one my son plays on now actually, has a love/hate relationship with video cards. And no, I don't buy cheap crappy computers or components, I've tried to buy quality every time.

You buy a good name brand computer, it will work as a unit. You can't guarantee that with a shop built item. Not in my experience anyway. I guess I should point out that I'm fussy and don't put up with any **** from a tool. A lot of what computer nuts consider just part of the game is intolerable to me - I use the brute to do work on, not to have to work on (to fix it).

I've gone for built up computers in the past because they are cheaper and easier to upgrade or repair than a name brand - ever tried to put parts in a Compaq that weren't Compaq parts? However, with the speed and power of modern computers, not to mention the price, I realised that I will not have to upgrade the thing within its working life. So I chose to go for the Dell and I'm happy I did. Best computer I've ever owned. But this doesn't just apply Dell. A mate, who builds computers for a hobby, chose an HP for his main machine at home for the same reasons and is just as happy as I am.

Just my twist on it as a computer user, not a computer tinkerer.

Richard
Windows XP - windows eXtra Problems

[namtrak]

Dont waste your energy on it. Save your pennies, buy a Dell laptop online (wait till they have a deal for extra memory and HD space) for about $1500, then get your self broadband through internode.on.net 16GB per month for $49 per month (we use about 1GB), then get a wireless access point and a wireless card for your laptop and bingo you are in the new age!! Guess you've figured that's what we have done. I have also wacked a wireless card in the kids PC which they reckon is pretty cool, and if your enterprising you may find 2 neighbours who are willing to part with some of the folding stuff or brews for access to the net across the wireless network (between the 6 connected users we use about 3 GB a month). The only drawback is that with the cheaper laptops you get what is called an integrated video card - they make it sound so new age!! All that means is that your video card shares it's memory and effectively you are precluded from playing the newest 3D games - this is the only drawback. The only other change I would have made is to get the longest possible warranty I could get (5 years) cause I reckon that'll just about see me out!!

Best of luck!!

PS I have some experience building PC's from scratch and whilst it is relatively straightforward - I would think long and hard about the value of a few hundred dollars difference. Anyway - best of luck.

[Grunt]

Ah yes, wireless laptops and broadband. Sit in front of the tele watching cricket and surfing this bb at the same time. :)

[Daddles]

Broadband? Broadband? **sob** I'm in metropolitan Adelaide and it's not available to me. Yes, they've upgraded the exchange, the problem is in the wiring from the exchange to me. I log on so often that I'd actually save money going to broadband (because I can't keep the phone like tied up all day with dial up). But no, because Telstra are so modern and efficient, because our telephone system is so up to date and well maintained (I heard the liberals say so on tele the other night), I can't get bloody broadband and there's nothing on the horizon to say I will. My sister is in the same boat.

[echnidna]

Ahhh yess Broadband.
But we can't get it except by satellite so we get stuck with a degenerate isdn service
(which I think costs more than Broadband)
or a totally lousy dialup service that falls offline so often you'd reckon the computer is mounted on the trampoline.
Courtesy of that wonderful Telco.

The wireless bit is interesting though - if we can get a system to work between some buildings about 100 metres apart with scatterred trees in between.

[namtrak]

The wireless bit is interesting though - if we can get a system to work between some buildings about 100 metres apart with scatterred trees in between.

Absolutely!! I can walk down our street with the laptop and get pretty good coverage for about 3 or 4 houses. You probably need to stick the access point up in the roof to provide a better line of sight, but other than that should be okay - still only really useful with broadband though :rolleyes:

Best of luck

[bitingmidge]

Absolutely!! I can walk down our street with the laptop and get pretty good coverage for about 3 or 4 houses. You probably need to stick the access point up in the roof to provide a better line of sight, but other than that should be okay - still only really useful with broadband though

Me too! For a few years I used to have my server in my office which was actuall the house next door. Wireless = reliable flexible network albeit with some security precautions needed!

As for broadband: Check out the recent changes under the government's HIBIS Initiative (now there's a great oxymoron - Government Initiative, right up there with Microsoft Office Works!) You may actually be eligible for a subsidised two-way sattelite connection. The bigpond site has some info, but many ISP's can do the same.

I am involved in a semi- remote area project and the two way sat seems to work OK (mostly).

Cheers,

P

[Honest Gaza]

Macca2....it obviously depends on what you want to achieve. For some, building a computer is a hobby. You may not save much money, but you feel a sense of achievement ( much like woodworking ).

The biggest problem is that some of the no-name PC shops can provide them so cheaply, why bother expending your own time....unless you want to as a hobby. PC User magazine frequently offers articles on the best PC's for under $1,500, $2,500 etc and nominates suppliers.

I see from your profile you are based in WA. This may not help you, but here is a website to view to get an idea of prices offered by one of the suppliers that PC User frequently gives their No.1 award to. "www.pc-express.com.au"

An example : Athlon XP 2600+, 512Meg Memory, 80Gig HDD, DVD ROM, CD Writer, Win XP Operating System and 17inch monitor for $1,220. Pretty hard to build this yourself for less. There are cheaper PC's going around, but can they provide the same processing power when all components are taken into account ( ie. Motherboard, Graphics Card )

We bought a PC from this supplier about 18 months ago for my son and it's still going strong except for the viruses that he attracts from various websites. ( Must talk to him about that ).

[HappyHammer]

Alternatively you could cruise local car parks and nick a laptop from a car...:D

HH.

[Grunt]

Alternatively you could cruise local car parks and nick a laptop from a car...

HH.

You weren't down in Melbourne for last year Woodwork Show were you? I got my laptop nicked from my car. If it was you I want it back.

[echnidna]

And here woz I thinking "Grunt" must be the password into the technical innards of me new laptop. Geez maybe I orta scratch it off.

[macca2]

My thanks to all who have offered an amazing amount of advice. Not being a computer buff, and not even knowing what bits are desirable in a new computer I think I will take the advice of many and buy a ready built one.
Gaza.........I will look at your recomended web site, thanks.
A lot of good advice and as usual a bundle of humour.
No better BB anywhere

Macca

[namtrak]

Dell has an Ad listed in today's Weekend Australian Magazine.

$1000 for 2.8g processor, XP, 256 Ram, 80g hd, DVD burner but no monitor. Also integrated video (refer to previous post)
Extra $250 for 17in flatscreen.

[Bob Willson]

Just to stir the pot a bit, :)
I think that Dell are really at the bottom of the pile when it comes to value for money. 20 years ago Compaq were the Rolls Royce of computers (along with HP) they are now all built for a LOW price, but offered at the highest price the maket will bear for their names.
As to your "clunkers" when you bought these machine sthey were top of the range. They used to really fly didn't they? The only thing that has really changed is the software that you ar etrying to run on them. Stop upgrading and making Micro$oft even richer. DOS is the the fastest operating system that micro$oft ever wrote.
Unix (or linux) or one of its many incarnations will happily run a graphical operating system on a 486, and if you can give it 64 meg of memory it will be in 7th heaven.
OK so Midge likes his Apple computer. The problem with apples is that they are so expensive and proprietary that only the rich people can afford them. They wear them like a sort of badge of honour :D. It isn't that they are that much better at everything, thay are just good at graphics. They still fall over regularly.
My first computer was a Sorcerer from Dick Smith for $2000. It had a total of 32K of memory. that thing really flew. It gave output that just as fast or even faster than the computers of today. No Hard drive, no floppy drive and used an operating system called CPM (Computer Program Maintenance). It had a tape drive that took about 3/4 of an hour to load a 32 k program in at about 300 baud. that was the worst thing about it. :(
I sold that and got an Apple II. At the time IBM hadn't produced a PC so there was no standard for everone to follow. I quite liked the Apple but everything about it was so bloody expensive because Apple wouldn't allow anyone else to make anything for it. So after a year I got rid of that and got my first PC. Haven't looked back since. :)
Build your own and learn a new skill. Try this link (http://www.sundaycomputermarket.com.au/) for parts at prices that are close to wholesale (lower in some cases) I am sure that you will have a similar place close to you.

[vsquizz]

I'm with Bob on this one. Get yourself a good motherboard (Like an MSI 865 Neo, some have onboard network card)), Seagate Barracuda Hard Drive (120Gb being the default size these days), some DDR ram and a good quality graphics Card. A P4 processor at 2.6 Ghz is the base model now and hyperthreading is worth it. There is lots of good variable speed ultra quiet power supplies around now which are excellent. It may be possible to use your old case but in any (case:D ) you can get a cheap one for less than $40.00. Then your in business.

If your not up to it discuss your requirements with a computer shop for which you can get a reference.

I messed around upgrading and in the end it was wasted money. I have a mate who runs a computer shop and he build better systems then the Dell for about 1/3 less $$$ and still makes a good profit. What does that tell you.

Cheers

[bitingmidge]

OK so Midge likes his Apple computer. The problem with apples is that they are so expensive and proprietary that only the rich people can afford them. They wear them like a sort of badge of honour . It isn't that they are that much better at everything, thay are just good at graphics. They still fall over regularly.


OUCH!!! :eek: It's been a while since you've actually seen an Apple machine hasn't it Bob? :D :D

Being as filthy rich as I am, I have to confess to lashing out a little under $1,500 on my eMac configured oh-so similarly to the Dell "bargain" above, but mine came with a 17" flat screen. (How do you operate without a screen Dell people??) Of course had I been as poor as the rest of you :D , being a fanatic I probably would have spent $1,295 and settled for the CD burner version.

Oh! Did I tell you that that price includes every bit of software you can possibly imagine one might ever need in a home environment??

As for them "falling over" ... well a few years ago, incredible as this may seem, Apple invented a series of little things that stick out from below the computer to steady them. :D :D :D

Seriously :cool: the current (last couple of years) version of the Operating System ensures that if one particular application hangs (and ironically I have only ever had this happen with expensive MS products!!), it is a simple matter to kill only that application, nothing else is interrupted.

I am not sure where you get your info Bob, but I am a pretty heavy user of a wide range of software products, and can't remember the last time anything "fell over"...

As for what does what better??? Forget it...graphics vs other stuff is just another furphy....they all do the same or near enough these days, only one bit of hardware comes configured in its basic form with all you need to do it though!

Some days I just wonder why I don't keep my little secret to myself! :D :D :D

P (Who feels a little better now) :cool: :cool: :cool:

[bitingmidge]

Another note for those that can afford Apples!

The first series (up to five year old) iMac DVD versions can be bought for a few hundred dollars, with a lot of ram added (min 512k) even the older 400mb machines work quite well for most things under the current operating system. $300 should be enough to get a perfectly servicable machine if you are not into heavy gaming.

You'll have to lash out on a DVD burner though.

One of my kids is a photographer and and while the (600) machine (equvalent to about 1gig in the PC world) is a bit slow by modern standards for heavy graphic processing it still serves her well, and worth every cent of the $250 it cost including burner and scanner, built in ethernet , modem, wireless networking etc etc.

Pity professional software doesn't come as cheap!

P

[vsquizz]

I would be nice to have a thread about computers not degrade into a Apple vs PC debate:D , just for a change:rolleyes: I mean its only a box of numbers and mice in little wheels an stuff...and everbody knows Mac's are second rate rubbish:p


Cheers in faceas agitation:D

[Bob Willson]

Hold on folks, i think I've hooked into a biggy here. :D

[echnidna]

I would be nice to have a thread about computers not degrade into a Apple vs PC debate:D , just for a change:rolleyes: I mean its only a box of numbers and mice in little wheels an stuff...and everbody knows Mac's are second rate rubbish:p
Cheers in faceas agitation:D

Well if you just replace the mice with hamsters and give the hamsters a good feed of baked beans you will end up with a turbo charged Mac!

[namtrak]

I have a mate who runs a computer shop and he build better systems then the Dell for about 1/3 less $$$ and still makes a good profit. What does that tell you.

Cheers


$1000 for 2.8g processor, XP, 256 Ram, 80g hd, DVD burner but no monitor. Also integrated video (refer to previous post)

Vsquizz, I reckon I can call your bluff. Design me a better PC (box only) for $667. My definition of a better PC would be to have maybe 512Ram and a decent video card. And then show me the profit. And Im interested in the warranty your offering on each component? :)

[Bob Willson]

And Im interested in the warranty your offering on each component? :)


All new components would have the manufacturers warrantywhich is usually at least 1 year

[Bob Willson]

MODEL NAME TRIGEN - INTEL SPECIAL

PROCESSOR INTEL CELERON 2.6G PROCESSOR

MOTHERBOARD INTEL MOTHERBOARD

RAM 256MB DDR RAM

HARD DISK 40GB 7200 EIDE HARD DRIVE

FLOPPY DRIVE 1.44 FLOPPY DRIVE

VIDEO CARD INTEGRATED VIDEO

CASE ATX MIDI CASE WITH PSU

OPTICAL DRIVE 52X 32X 52X CDWRITER

INTERNAL MODEM INTERNAL 56.6K MODEM

NETWORK CARD 10/100 NETWORK CARD

ANTI VIRUS NORTON ANTI VIRUS

SOFTWARE SUPER 10 PACK

KEYBOARD DELUXE KEYBOARD

MOUSE PS/2 MOUSE

SPEAKERS AMPLIFIED SPEAKERS



Includes – Norton Anti Virus, Nero Burn CD, OpenOffice.org, Print Shop 20, Spam Catcher , After Dark Games, Atari 80 Classic Games, Diskeeper lite, Easy Fax, Eudora Pro Email 6, Globe Productive, iClean, Mavis Beacon Teaches Typing Version 16, Music Match 8.2, , Stuff It Standard 8.0, World Book 2005, World Tours Golf



PRICE $530

extra RAM +$50
Reasonable video card $50
Profit about $60
This of course is by taking Visquizz's off hand price at face value. I would normally charge a bit more than that and make the profit about $150

[namtrak]

Nice try but....

That's not a better computer - 2.6 CPU is smaller, same RAM 256, 40 gb hard drive (half the size of the Dell), still an integrated video card and no DVD burner. And when something goes kaput, do I have to identify the component - then pull the component out and wait until it is returned to have my warranty fulfilled? And as for the Decent Video card (128mb) at $50? I think your really looking at around $200 (I'll give you $90 at the lower end) :)

Next.....

[vsquizz]

Bob your having a productive day.

Namtrak, warranty is a good point. I have no problems with my shop, they warrant the item even if the distributor, importer or manufacturer don't but thats rare.

Its hard to fathom value in all the advertised garb because its designed to appear good. Sometimes the specials are a great buy. Sometimes its just old stock. Computer hardware costs vary dramatically on the dollar.

I know my mate doesn't panic about things like Hardly normal, Dell etc, he just loves it when somebody brings one of those ads into the shop.

FYI I have the 2.8 H/T, 4 dimm MB with onboard ethernet, 1Gb DDR, and 2 x SATA 80Gb HD, DVD Read CD Burn and GeForce FX 5700 with 256 Ram all for $1400.00. Not bad on old prices that Dell wanted well over 2 grand for at the time. Oh there was a Sound Blaster Live thrown in for stamps. The Philips DVD player is now about half the price I paid..Oh and a GeForce FX 5200 with 128 of Ram is currently $59.00

You just got to keep an eye on prices and know what quality you are getting. I didn't say the Dell was on the nose but you can build a better machine for less if you know what you are doing.

Great Deals do appear.

Cheers

[Bob Willson]

You didn't read it properly namtrak
I put at the bottom of the quote that an upgrade to 512 meg would cost another $50 and that the card would cost another $50. Just checked the prices and the video card is 128meg / GEFORCE4 MX4000 but it does cost $77
and for the 80 gig HDD plus about $15

I think that you will find that the Dell has onboard graphics, so any card is going to be better than that.
You are being a bit unreasonable in your demands. The 2.6 gig and the 2.8 are so close it really doesn't matter much.
PS Dell will also charge you $100 to deliver the computer. NO EXCEPTIONS

[vsquizz]

Well this better than Mac vs PC anyway;) ..now what was the original question??? Oh yes, computers are consumables..2 to 4 year lifespan, hardly worth upgrading these days but I'll go against the trend and hang on until its unbearable:D . Money can be better spent on working out how to steal Woodborer's LN's:rolleyes:

Cheers

[craigb]

I didn't realise that there were so many computer tragics on this board :eek:

Like Mr Squizzy says, I'd rather spend $800 on a LN jointer than a bloody computer be it a PC or a freakin Mac. I mean, we're woodwrokers ferchrisake, who bloody cares? :confused:

Buy the cheapest damn computer that will satisfy your needs.

[bitingmidge]

Ahhhh I love the smell of fried insect in the morning!!

1. Anything to do with computers is tragic.

2. If it weren't for that well known fruit brand there'd be nothing to discuss!

3. Of course all these posts involving terms like G-Force, Celeron, ATX, Optical Drive are akin to discussing nothing anyway.

P
:D :D :D
(The box said "requires Windows XP or better, so I bought a Mac)

:D :D :D :D :D :D

[craigb]

Ahhhh I love the smell of fried insect in the morning!!



:D

My tirade wasn't aimed at you exclusively Midge.

It's just that I've endured so many useless arguements over the relative merits of different platforms and operating systems that I tend to go off nowadays. Sorry :o

Craig

(Off to take his medication)

:)

[bitingmidge]

Hey Craig!

Better Retract that Apology NOW!!!

I hadn't even read anything heated in your post :eek: :eek: I was just taking another low pot-shot at all the other tragics who don't know the joys of using a computer named after a plastic raincoat....perhaps that apology should come from me :p , but I'm not due to renew the annual one for another couple of weeks.

And yes, the arguments are indeed useless...but what's a woodwroker?

:D :D :D

I'm off to sit in the sun now!

P

[Bob Willson]

Ahhhh I love the smell of fried insect in the morning!!

1. Anything to do with computers is tragic.

2. If it weren't for that well known fruit brand there'd be nothing to discuss!

3. Of course all these posts involving terms like G-Force, Celeron, ATX, Optical Drive are akin to discussing nothing anyway.

P
:D :D :D
(The box said "requires Windows XP or better, so I bought a Mac)

:D :D :D :D :D :D


Oooh ,ooh ooh, can I bite; please sir? Choose me sir, choose me, Oh siiir, pleeeeaasssee sir. :D :D :D

PS Better than Windows XP = Unix. NOT Fruit Loops :D

[craigb]

And yes, the arguments are indeed useless...but what's a woodwroker?



Closely related to a woodwrecker in my case. :D

[bitingmidge]

PS Better than Windows XP = Unix.

Bob Willson, computer cross-dresser!!!

Surely you are setting me up??? Tell me you didn't know that the Mac operating system is Unix based.....please tell me this is a Freudian slip!!

:D :D :D :D

P

[Daddles]

Hang on, I thought we were talking about computers and now we're talking about eunichs and cross dressing. What happened to the pancakes?

Richard

[echnidna]

The cross dressed eunuchs ate the pancakes??

[namtrak]

PS Dell will also charge you $100 to deliver the computer. NO EXCEPTIONS

Im a bit over it now but Dell actually offer free delivery on nearly every purchase online. Our Lappie came free or charge, and most ads advertise free of charge. Dell's biggest drawback is it doesn't install RedHat as the standard O/S - but that's easy to fix

Cheers

[Fat Pat]

I have a Pentium 150, works for me, though I do run Netscape instead of IE.

Can anyone beat that?

[Bob Willson]

Well, until recently I had a 486DX66 with 32 meg of memory, running FreeBSD ( a Unix type operating system) to handle my net connection and act as a firewall. It could also handle graphics and never fell over. The only time it ever stopped was when there was a power failure. Average uptime for Unix systems can be counted in months or even years.
There was a bit of a joke going around a while ago. Micro$oft issued a warning that after about 5 months their Windows 98 operating system COULD become unstable. I don't know anybody who could keep that running for more than a week so how did they ever find out?

[adrian]

I agree with the people who said to buy one. If you don't know enough about computers you can get yourself into a lot of trouble.
A five year old computer may not be upgradeable. You may find that the only thing you will keep is the floppy drive. I got an upgrade price do do mine and it worked out to be a little over $700. That was a new case, motherboard, cpu and ram. For a few hundred dollars more I could get a Dell or HP with new larger screen, dvd, hard disk ten times the size of mine and a new operating system.

Forget upgrading such an old computer.

[Daddles]

The really sad part of all this is my laptop. It's a pentium 100. That's right, an ancient Toshiba Satellite 100CS (it's the good one, got the colour screen). Old. Slow. I turn it on and go make a cup of coffee while it works out whether it's awake or not. It runs Win95 and a stripped down version of Office 2000. But, the battery runs for about three hours which is enough to rattle off 3,000 words of a novel. I go for a walk and by the time I'm ready to fire again, the old girl is fully charged ready for another attack. She's travelled all around the country with nary a beat missed. I bought her second hand and have had her six years now. My ex always promised me she'd buy me a new one when it died but it outlasted the marriage.

One day, I will buy a new laptop. It'll have one of those stupid heat pad mice instead the nice 'tit in the middle of the keyboard'. The battery won't last as long because it has to run so much to keep the operating system alive and it'll take longer to recharge. It'll run faster but seeing the old girl can keep up with my typing, that won't be an improvement. And it won't last as long. I guess that's called progress, but like a lot of words, its meaning has become polluted when applied to modern technology.

And no, I don't want a flamin' plastic raincoat.

Richard

[silentC]

Micro$oft issued a warning that after about 5 months their Windows 98 operating system COULD become unstable. I don't know anybody who could keep that running for more than a week so how did they ever find out?
It's even better than that. I was told by a help desk person at Telstra that they recommend you reinstall Win98 at least once every 6 months to prevent connection problems.

On the other hand, one of our Web servers, running Windows 2000, which I have just checked has clocked up 208 days worth of 'System Idle Process' CPU time. I don't remember when it was rebooted last.

[adrian]

It's even better than that. I was told by a help desk person at Telstra that they recommend you reinstall Win98 at least once every 6 months to prevent connection problems.



My pc is a pentium 200 that I built about 7 years ago and my hard disk gets repartitioned and formatted on an annual basis. It's amazing how much the performance improves. It's the computer version of a colonic.

[adrian]

But, the battery runs for about three hours which is enough to rattle off 3,000 words of a novel. I go for a walk and by the time I'm ready to fire again, the old girl is fully charged ready for another attack.
Richard

You're a better man than I gungadin. It takes me a whole day to write 2000 words. I've been hinting to my daughter for a laptop for ages. Maybe before she comes to OZ next time I'll include some URLs from Dell and HP in an email and tell her I would have written sooner but I've been waiting for my PC to boot up. That might work........ ;)