HELP WANTED FROM MEMBERS - with forum speed problem

[steven]

Ross (and others interested), I find the best way to search the forums is to use google. The command to use is:

"SEARCH WORDs + site:http://www.woodworkforums.com" in the google search box

So, for your search try -

"Sliding dovetail to minimise wracking site:www.woodworkforums.com"

To find "shellac" try

"shellac site:www.woodworkforums.com"

Ok that whole section was set to not index posts in search results. I'll need to check the other forum sections and rebuild the search index. It will prob take 5 - 8 hours to run and we will need run it at a low traffic time.

[springwater]

When you try and upload pics which I assume are over some Kb limit you get an error about a "...token missing..." when you used to get a message saying your over limit you bludy idiot or words to that effect.

[steven]

When you try and upload pics which I assume are over some Kb limit you get an error about a "...token missing..." when you used to get a message saying your over limit you bludy idiot or words to that effect.

I don't think they're directly related, tho an upload that takes to long time (even tho its under the limit) could cause a token error.

Can you send me a copy of the file your having trouble with? [email protected]

It would also be helpful if you could include some general info like;'

- location you're uploading pics?
- Connection speed (ISP plan)
- Time of day the error appeared
- OS
- Browser

... and anything else you think could be helpful.

thanks

[steven]

Not sure if this is related or no - here goes:

I posted this thread http://www.woodworkforums.com/f213/sliding-dovetail-minimise-wracking-129780/

However It does not seem to show up in new posts or in any form of search (tried searching by poster, by keyword etc)

I was wondering why I got no reply, so searched for the post & it did not come up. It does show under "The Workbench" subforum


OK the re-indexing was a little to brief :oo:, but its now showing up when you do a search with keywords match you title.

[RossM]

Thanks Steve

I'll bump the thread anyway, as still no responses (or maybe its just a boring topic :rolleyes:)

[springwater]

Sorry for the delay Steven, I was called for dinner. Yeah I think your right, the upload did seem to take longer than usual and I suspect it was more like a time-out that caused the "Token Error', even though, I did forget to reduce the size of the pics. Once the pics were reduced in size they uploaded quite quickly but I didn't record the time taken.

- location you're uploading pics?
This may be a dumb answer but I'm in Somers, Victoria

- Connection speed (ISP plan)
@ 9.42pm, 15_1_2011: Download = 2816 Kbps, Upload 390 Kbps
My provider is Peopletelecom.com.au (http://www.woodworkforums.com/peopletelecom.com.au.html), I use a Belkin ADSL 2 modem.

- Time of day the error appeared
About 10.00pm

- OS
MS Windows XP, Ver # 2002, Service Pack 3

- Browser
IE Ver # 8.0.6001.18707IC

The pics were uploaded by using the attachments button in the advanced reply window, they were:

DSC02423: 2,002 KB, 3264 x 2448 px reduced to 160 Kb, 800 x 600 px (using MS Picture Manager)

DSC02419: 2,872 KB, 3264 x 2448 px reduced to 231 Kb, 511 x 800 px (using MS Picture Manager)

DSC02406: 2,375 KB, 3264 x 2448 px reduced to 194 Kb, 800 x 600 px (using MS Picture Manager)

DSC02400: 2,947 KB, 2448 x 3264 px reduced to 316 Kb, 600 x 800 px (using MS Picture Manager)


I don't think they're directly related, tho an upload that takes to long time (even tho its under the limit) could cause a token error.

I don't think the pics were the culprit but I can email them to you if you think necessary. Hope this helps :-


Can you send me a copy of the file your having trouble with? [email protected]

It would also be helpful if you could include some general info like;'

- location you're uploading pics?
- Connection speed (ISP plan)
- Time of day the error appeared
- OS
- Browser

... and anything else you think could be helpful.

thanks

[Groggy]

location you're uploading pics?
From Hoppers in Melbourne to http://www.woodworkforums.com/f213/wip-groggys-workbench-76785/#post1263247

- Connection speed (ISP plan)
Bigpond Cable

- Time of day the error appeared
10:15PM

- OS
Win7

- Browser
Chrome

From choosing "Submit Reply" to the post actually appearing was over 1 minute, closer to 1:30sec . No error occured but it did take a long time. There were five pictures and they uploaded quickly.

[Cliff Rogers]

I think I might know what your problem is.... :think:


...Hoppers in Melbourne....

Just a guess. :D

[hughie]

All good for me since the 27th Dec-20Jan, I'm in the back blocks of Asia on wifi and all things considered its just fine. :2tsup:

hughie

[wheelinround]

Up and down when I have been on during the day sorry didn't keep times etc even Pm's were slow to load etc. Then as in this thread and others (http://www.woodworkforums.com/f8/birthday-gtg-sunday-30th-jan-129788/#post1264197) our Names are in RED :?

Subscribed threads still coming in at 6/6.30pm I have been into the User area and can't locate anything to alter that.

[arose62]

10:00 PM -ish I noticed that the usernames are now in various very bright colours (which I personally don't like), so I tried all the skins, searched for an announcement of a change, bore in mind the recent problems and request for reports so tacked onto this thread.

Cheers,
Andrew

[Eldanos of KDM]

10:00 PM -ish I noticed that the usernames are now in various very bright colours (which I personally don't like), so I tried all the skins, searched for an announcement of a change, bore in mind the recent problems and request for reports so tacked onto this thread.

Cheers,
Andrew

I've noticed this too- Not a big deal as far as I'm concerned, but probably worth mentioning...

Also I just noticed this
Welcome, Eldanos of KDM (http://www.woodworkforums.com/members/16087-eldanos-of-kdm/).
You last visited: 12th Jan 2011 at 03:31 PM Private Messages (http://www.woodworkforums.com/private.php): Unread 0, Total 34.
Your PM box is 100% full.


AfAIK It wasn't 'full' last time I looked and I haven't received a PM in ages... (So cold and lonely on my end :wink:) Something might have changed recently that i didn't notice though- Or maybe it was always like that- Where am I and what day is it?:D

[Eldanos of KDM]

Maybe the amount of saved messages dropped and I didn't noticed- Anyway problem solved, my bad....

[Eldanos of KDM]

Ok one more...
When I tried to look at this album
http://www.woodworkforums.com/members/65331-blackgizmo/albums/wooden-desk-lamp/

I got this...

vBulletin Message

Eldanos of KDM, you do not have permission to access this page. This could be due to one of several reasons:

Your user account may not have sufficient privileges to access this page. Are you trying to edit someone else's post, access administrative features or some other privileged system?
If you are trying to post, the administrator may have disabled your account, or it may be awaiting activation.

Log Out (http://www.woodworkforums.com/login.php?do=logout&logouthash=1295269474-04e55f2399efbb82f8661e2f6ea8035a08f65407) Home (http://www.woodworkforums.com/)



Are you guys breaking up with me?

[RETIRED]

Eldanos, that album was deleted as Spam hence the message. It no longer exists.:wink:

[Girius]

Hi
Most pages load normally for me.
I have found that only when i do a "search" it takes a longer time.
About 10 to 20 seconds.

GA

[acmegridley]

Tried to logon at 6.40 local time came up with "database error"

[wheelinround]

10 mins to log in 1842 now

1843 database error trying to move away from this thread

[BeanerSA]

Whilst trying to load "Today's Posts" at
http://www.woodworkforums.com/search.php?do=getdaily&exclude=84,76,79,77,78,80,81,82,83,85

I got the following error

The Woodwork Forums database has encountered a problem.

at the time on the top of this post.

[munruben]

This is the first time I have been able to get on for the last 2 hours. Frustrating:(

[Sturdee]

Todays post & New posts search functions don't work I get the following:



Database error
The Woodwork Forums database has encountered a problem.
Please try the following:
Load the page again by clicking the Refresh button in your web browser.
Open the Woodwork Forums - Powered by vBulletin (http://www.woodworkforums.com) home page, then try to open another page.
Click the Back button to try another link.
The Woodwork Forums - Powered by vBulletin (http://www.woodworkforums.com) forum technical staff have been notified of the error, though you may contact them if the problem persists.

We apologise for any inconvenience.

[ajw]

Database error screen when I try to use "New Posts" shortcut. First problem I've had with this.

ajw

[steven]

Please don't post problems relating to the last couple of hours, a database issue caused by a server crash meant we had some unexpected downtime.

regards

[Big Shed]

Please don't post problems relating to the last couple of hours, a database issue caused by a server crash meant we had some unexpected downtime.

regards

This is happening right now, not in the past, the database problems are still there!

[woodturner777]

Lot of problems this end the past few weeks, site slow in loading and off line a few times.
I have high speed ADSL.

[MK I]

G'day Neil,

Up until yesterday i have had no problems, but last night at about 6.00 I could not log onto any wbsite with the URL containing woodworkforums. All other websites, such as Ubeaut, etc were ok. My browser (IE7) just went to the default "could not connect to this webpage" page. This lasted for about 30 mins till 6.30 when I gave up. I currently run ADSL 2.

Mark

[RETIRED]

G'day Neil,

Up until yesterday i have had no problems, but last night at about 6.00 I could not log onto any wbsite with the URL containing woodworkforums. All other websites, such as Ubeaut, etc were ok. My browser (IE7) just went to the default "could not connect to this webpage" page. This lasted for about 30 mins till 6.30 when I gave up. I currently run ADSL 2.

MarkThe server fell over for a while.

[woodie one]

Lots of problems on MacBook Pro running Snow Leopard and Safari via ADSL with all updates issued by Apple:

loading - display line highlights "http://v" (where the v signifies half of the first w in www) and then hangs. Sometimes times out, other times still hanging after approx five minutes. Problem does not occur with any other website.

images in messages - can't see these even though other posters report that they can.

Hope this helps,

Cheers

[enak]

Slow load, 21/01/2011, 1.08am.
Slow load on search, around 1 minute, but results came up fine.

[Sawdust Maker]

Very slow load after hitting post reply button

bottom left of screen said 'waiting for cdn.woodworkingforums.com'

I eventually gave up as nothing happenng whilst I got a coffee - this was about 3.15pmI have ISDN connection

I eventually left the forum. couldn't get back in. Just tried again now and ok

[Terry B]

Pages hanging today (21st) whilst looking at the Friday fred.
It took 15mins to get the page to reload. Other websites were working fine at the time.

[ajw]

multiple Page not Available errors for about the past 20 minutes. Looks like the problems aren't fully resolved yet.

ajw.

[Shedhand]

timed out twice.7.30pm.
Running with Firefox ,Chrome and Opera (all latest updates) on Intel pentium dual cpu Windows Vista Premium. Upload speed 1.4mb/sec -D/l speed 2.5mb/sec

[IWieldTheSpade]

I've had the same problem as Shedhand, except at about 7.20pm. Continuous time outs, but I gave up at around 7.30pm, got back on at 7.40

Cheers

[Stustoys]

I'm currently having a problem with the pages not loading. No error message it just sits there trying to load. I have two pc's and both are doing the same thing. If I use a poxy server it works fine. I'm with optus. It looks like a DNS problem to me(but then I dont know much). If is doesnt clear soon I'll try changing from the optus DNS
Stuart

p.s. Working fine again at 11:12pm. Not so sure it was a dns problem.

[Fuzzie]

New posts was just hanging for me.

It looks like lost packets from my end. If I stop and hit the reload button the search page loads quickly on the second attempt.

[joez]

Just took me just me about 4 minutes to load the main page of the forum.

Not sure if it means anything but i noticed the attached message in my browsers status bar (waiting for cdn.woodworkforums.com...)

[Cliff Rogers]

No errors, just vvvvvveeeeeeerrrrrrrryyyyyyyyy sssssslllllllooooooowwww.

15 minute to post a message.

[pjt]

In general I find that probs occour a bit intermittandly, a slow page load, usually don't get any error messages, attaching pictures can be a bit:( frustrating at times, the attach pop up box is not complete, I have just now clicked on freehanding a log in half by RSG and am still waiting while I have written this 5 mins at least, ADSL2 here ahh not sure about the tech stuff unless it's written down in front of me:B

Pete

[Master Splinter]

Forum was very (minutes) slow to load a reply at 1.00am ish AEDT 22/1.

Pathping results (done about 1/2 hour apart) below.

Note that west-datacentre.net seemed to be having 99% packet loss, if I'm reading them right.

[jow104]

Service returned to normal high quality up here the past two weeks.

[Groggy]

Forum was very (minutes) slow to load a reply at 1.00am ish AEDT 22/1.

Pathping results (done about 1/2 hour apart) below.

Note that west-datacentre.net seemed to be having 99% packet loss, if I'm reading them right.MS, that is useful.:2tsup:

What was the syntax you used?

[Cliff Rogers]

run cmd

tracert Woodwork Forums - Powered by vBulletin (http://www.woodworkforums.com)

[Groggy]

Cliff, I've been running it a few different ways but the output is not as comprehensive as MS's.

C:\Users\Greg>pathping -n woodworkforums.com

Tracing route to woodworkforums.com [68.169.38.142]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
0 192.168.0.22
1 192.168.0.100
2 10.227.112.1
3 * * *
Computing statistics for 50 seconds...
Source to Here This Node/Link
Hop RTT Lost/Sent = Pct Lost/Sent = Pct Address
0 192.168.0.22
0/ 100 = 0% |
1 0ms 0/ 100 = 0% 0/ 100 = 0% 192.168.0.100
100/ 100 =100% |
2 --- 100/ 100 =100% 0/ 100 = 0% 10.227.112.1

Trace complete.

It is getting caught up locally somehow.

[Cliff Rogers]

Some nodes don't allow responses to those sorts of network diags 'cos they can be used in a DOS attack to flood it & slow it down.

[A Duke]

Hi,
From about 1420 to now when I try to load a page It start and then hangs. The green worm in the right hand bottom corner of my screen fills up to the last 6 to 2mm then just stop for 2 to 5 minutes waiting for the forum. Both when I am logged in and not.
Yours

[hughie]

Today 22nd Sat Jan 4.20pm onwards the site is slow to load. After couple of posts the site slowed down dramatically, to the point I could not logon at one stage. Persisted and here I am.

[Master Splinter]

I was using pathping, no switches.

Microsoft Corporation (http://www.microsoft.com/resources/documentation/windows/xp/all/proddocs/en-us/pathping.mspx?mfr=true)

Gee...isnt that a useful title retrieved from the link. Really informative, you can really tell that it is a product documentation resource for the pathping command.

[RayG]

Seems very intermittent, sometimes very good, (like it always has been) sometimes very slow, and then every so often just hangs.

Today I couldn't access any forums, every page, (except sometimes the main index page)was hanging, that was today around 4pm eastern daylight saving time.

So.

I ran ping and traceroute from a local linux box, ping times are consistent to www1.ubeaut.com.au (http://www.ubeaut.com) at around 200ms traceroute is being blocked at west-datacenter.net

Ok, so no connectivity issues...

I have access to a server in the US, so I ran the same from there and ping times consistent at around 50ms or so, traceroute still blocked by west-datacenter.net

I can't see a connectivity or bandwidth issue being the main cause, I suspect something in the vbulletin software is hanging.. that could be a real nightmare to track down... maybe start with the database and see if any particular queries are hanging.

mysql> show processlist
might provide a clue.

or just run "top" and see how the cpu/memory usage is going.

Regards
Ray

PS.. It's hanging again..5:30 this time I checked connectivity to cdn.woodworkforums.com seems a little variable, I notice the reverse lookup resolves to cdce.syd002.internap.com (202.58.141.130)

[RayG]

Not sure if this helps, but I notice that cdn.woodworkforums.com resolves to different servers at different times.
EDIT the dns server I'm using is dns.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.191)

sometimes I get cdce.syd002.internap.com (202.58.141.130)

and sometimes cdce.hkg002.internap.com (203.190.126.147)

various others at different times.. cdce.tok005.internap.com (122.200.36.146)

I guess it depends on how you have the servers setup? is there some kind of load sharing going on?

Regards Ray

PS. As another test, I tried http://cdn.woodworkforums.com/images/gradients/threadgradluan3.gif doing shift-reloads to clear browser cache issues, and times seem extremely slow

PPS.. Ok here is a definitive problem, that might help resolve the issue.
Just simply loading the gif image from http://cdn.woodworkforums.com/images/gradients/threadgradluan3.gif hung with a timeout error.
That would tend to eliminate any vbulletin database or scripting issues, and puts connectivity and dns problems back on the radar.
One way of testing that, would be to temporarily copy the custom style images somewhere else, edit the style scripts, and see if the problems go away.

PPPS. Ah, I get it.. it's a cloud layer.. that explains it, maybe it's a cache timing issue in the cloud, or a dodgy server in the cloud.

Hope that helps.

[woodie one]

0700hrs GMT

Speed seems to have plummeted in the last 24 hours.

Text in status line indicates, and hangs at:
Loading "http://www.woodworkforums.com", completed 5 of 7 items
or ...6 of 8..., or ...7 of 8...

Connections (when made) seem very clunky and jerky.

[jow104]

Perfect up here.

Is this of any use, (basic) my internet provider virginmedia cable, worked a fast one on me in the week, it reduced my supposedly free virus protection and since I have not had to log into ubeaut. It is done automatically for me again like days of yore.

So perhaps your virus protection program is playing a part in the forum problems?

[RayG]

Ok,

Here is a problem, whether or not it's the only problem, I don't know.

The problem I see is the time taken to retrieve images from the cloud
I wrote a small script to just retrieve one image only from the cloud, it seemed to consistently download from the Sydney node.

Of course, if you were in the USA or UK you would be getting a different cloud node, and possibly not see any problem. So I suspect it might just be the Sydney server.

time wget http://cdn.woodworkforums.com/images/gradients/threadgradluan3.gif

Here are the times. with a 10 second pause between image downloads.

4.691
45.691
3.399
3.934
45.251
4.211
45.228
22.282
0.233
0.227
0.230
0.234
0.229

It's currently working fine, at the moment, sitting on about 0.25 seconds, but every so often it's taking up to 45 seconds.

I would think maybe it's time to talk to the cloud service provider.

Regards
Ray

[Cliff Rogers]

OK at present but I couldn't even load any pages for almost an hour.

[Big Mac]

Unable to load page for nearly an hour
Neil

[jow104]

Perfect here

[munruben]

First time I have been able to get on for about 2 hours:(

[munruben]

All other sites working and opening fine. I tried with 2 of my other computers and same problem used Firefox and then IE with no success

[Mr Brush]

Homepage very slow to load - progress bar gets to about 80% then stalls.

[jow104]

Perfect here.

[Cliff Rogers]

Good in small spurts, then takes ages to load a new page or do a reply & then suddenly good again.

[Mulgabill]

Just waited over 7mins to open this thread.:o Sorry life's too short, I'll go and do other things:C Good night!

[steven]

Not sure if this helps, but I notice that cdn.woodworkforums.com resolves to different servers at different times.
EDIT the dns server I'm using is dns.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.191)

sometimes I get cdce.syd002.internap.com (202.58.141.130)

and sometimes cdce.hkg002.internap.com (203.190.126.147)

various others at different times.. cdce.tok005.internap.com (122.200.36.146)

I guess it depends on how you have the servers setup? is there some kind of load sharing going on?


Hi there

A while back we off loaded some images and scripts/css to a content delivery network. The theory is, content is served from the closest POP to the user. Also if the closest is down, the user should get routed to the next closest and so on. It's generally a very reliable service, I haven't received any outage notices, but i'll run it by the tech support there. CDN issues can't cause database errors.

Besides that, the issue is disk IO goes from being very good, to very bad, for no apparent reason. The occasional pathetic disk performance causes database queries to run much slower and eventually build up, and database errors start generating once the user (for this site) has exceeded the allowed mysql connections. We've seen times where the SAN's data throughput is less than a 512kpbs ADSL connection :doh:

You can see the cause of a database error by viewing the page source, and looking for the bit the outlines the error.

We're moving the site in the coming week.

regards
steve

[Finnowa]

Neil,
Takes about 40sec to load page after clicking "Post Reply"
Hercus Area 8:30WST
Optus ADSL II
Took 30 sec to load this link!
Too slow to tolerate. Better things to do!!
Graeme

[Master Splinter]

Here's a log generated by the trial version of Http Analyser (sorted by load time)...300+ seconds....

[steven]

Here's a log generated by the trial version of Http Analyser (sorted by load time)...300+ seconds....

Hey, when was that done? 1500 seconds?? :oo:

[steven]

Here's a log generated by the trial version of Http Analyser (sorted by load time)...300+ seconds....

It looks like you're taking several hundred seconds to download a small image from one provider and almost 100 seconds to download a 1KB image from a completely different host. Neither image request should be held up because of database issues.

Either both hosts had problems at the same time, or the issue is at your end. If you can shoot us through a time and perhaps a few repeat tests @ different times of the day, that might help.

regards

[coffenup]

last night at approx 10.00 pm adelaide time I just gave up trying to look at the forum
was looking at the turning pages & market place both took 5 times longer at least to load . Tried other sites eg google, ebay, gumtree, and other wood working sites all loaded the the same as normal,
checked my connection speeds with server on line was all ok
this is not the first time
I am using mozilla firefox web brouser
regards Michael
extra
this posting took 2 mins to up load

[ubeaut]

We definitely need to get away from this new super-dooper cloud server thing and get on to something more stable and reliable without losing performance or speed. We know this for a fact, however finding something that's going to do the job isn't as easy as it sounds.

We were previously with, what was supposedly the best provider for our use before, in The Planet however they were taken over by SoftLayer and some of the reports since the takeover have been less than kind to them. Besides that, we were getting complaints from mods and admins about speed and we had a couple of major crashes due to broken or corrupted hard drives etc.

We need a provider that has as close to 100% up time as possible. Can handle well over 100,000 enquiries, searches etc, etc, per day (many don't have a hope) and doesn't cost the earth to use. The last almost completely rules out most Australian sites.

Any input from members would be most greatly appreciated and will be looked into for feasibility. In the mean time I guess we're just stuck with the problem we have till something else can be sorted out.

Hopefully next week should see all the problems sorted once and for all..... Until the next time.

Cheers - Neil :no:

[Interwood]

Last night (over a 6 hour period) I couldn't even access the forums from the UBEAUT page???

When I used saved links to get to individual forums ..... each loaded about 90% of the way and then stopped.

Is Google the cause of this???

While I was watching what Firefox was doing it seemed to be getting to asking Google for something and then stopping??

Just my 2 cents worth.

Interwood .... not able to get inter the forums

[RayG]

Any input from members would be most greatly appreciated and will be looked into for feasibility. In the mean time I guess we're just stuck with the problem we have till something else can be sorted out.


Hi Neil,

Have you looked at this option? Amazon Elastic Compute Cloud (Amazon EC2) (http://aws.amazon.com/ec2/)

Regards
Ray

[Dengue]

Hi Neil, I found your web site very slow all weekekend, starting Saturday afternoon. It could take over 30 seconds to load a page, and the search function was much, much slower. Sometimes I would walk away and try again a few hours later, but there was no improvement.

It is still very slow this morning

[mkypenturner]

neil
has been slow last few days even gone surfing the net or checking my emails and this morning 5: 40 took about a minute to load after logging in done a speed test1.28mb/s

[jow104]

Very fast up here.

[munruben]

I give up. I just spent 15 minutes trying to post in a box making thread. :- Yet I can open the thread and I posted once in it tonight and then a few minutes later tried to post again in answer to a question and no luck.

[jow104]

no problems here

[Dengue]

Hello, It took a couple of goes to open your web site this morning at the search page, and the succesful go took about 30 seconds.

Opening any page takes about the same length of time. I have a progress bar for each page opening, and it seems to load the first 90% reasonably quickly, then hangs quite a while for the last 10%

[Cliff Rogers]

Good here.

[munruben]

Same as JillB; slow as this morning. All other websites I visit are working fine. It seems to come and go, Once minute its okay and the next slows to a crawl or stalls. I usually give up after 5 minutes or so.

[Sawdust Maker]

good here

[Dengue]

hi Neil, I have found the web site to be much faster today. Thanks for all your efforts in getting this up and working properly. I am sure it was not easy

[Cliff Rogers]

Was good all day til a couple of minutes ago, slow to load & then suddenly fine again.

[ubeaut]

We are in the process of moving the forums across to the new server as I type. Had a few major issues the previous 2 nights when moving Reno across and had to pospone moving WWF till tonight.

Weird stuff may happen over the next couple or few hrs. Be patient and all should be fine and dandy from tomorrow morning onwards.

Cheers - Neil :U

[AUSSIE]

:2tsup:Thanks Neil .You do a great job:2tsup:

[wheelinround]

Ok was about to let you know data base errors just happening.

[jow104]

Smilies not working for me.

But not a disaster of course.

First time, this went a bit sticky, around 30 seconds plus? EDit.

[jow104]

Actually, the same on the UK forum, posting a message is sticky as well.

[Groggy]

John, there is a large transfer of files occurring at present. Neil has posted a message aout it. Should be over in an hour or so.

[ubeaut]

May not be over till around 9pm our time but me being the eternal pessimist when it comes to transfers etc wold reckon it may even be as late as 10pm

[jow104]

OK, this one is working , still no smilies.

[steven]

Hey

I'm looking into this now

thanks