DIY plywood sealer to stain??

[kroozzn62]

G'day all, This is my first post ,i need a tip on a cheap option to seal bb hoop pine plywood to stain and lacquer as im build low cost boxes for shop to sell and need to cut costs where i can, Is there a trick to make up your own sand sealer???
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[ian]

if cutting costs is the primary goal, have you considered using veneered MDF rather than BB ply?
in my experience, veneered MDF is ready to finish, while BB ply needs some sanding before applying a finish

[kroozzn62]

I choose ply for the edge will be exposed with the nice ply edge pattern detail, thanks for the idea though,but edging will bump the labour up to much. So im looking at a cheap spray on sealer, the boxes are designed to be fairly rustic looking like a crate so the spray detail wont have to be perfect...:2tsup:

[ian]

well if the boxes are
designed to be fairly rustic looking like a crate then I don't see why you'd bother with a sanding sealer

a couple of coats of lacquer, a quick scrub sand and then a couple more should result in an acceptable, though refined "rustic" look

make a few and see what works

[kroozzn62]

these boxes i had sold before but the manufacturer took on a different course and dropped them as a product?, we were selling heaps of them ,so Ive made a few already and might have an order on its way, but need to minimize the material cost a tad, If im right in what your saying Ian is a sealer just for high quality finishes and can i dust over the boxes after a light sanding with lacquer and that should seal enough to stain and lacquer on top? Maybe i can thin it down too? I'm using Wattyl interior estapol ?

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[ian]

these boxes i had sold before but the manufacturer took on a different course and dropped them as a product?, we were selling heaps of them ,so Ive made a few already and might have an order on its way, but need to minimize the material cost a tad,
If im right in what your saying Ian is a sealer just for high quality finishes and can i dust over the boxes after a light sanding with lacquer and that should seal enough to stain and lacquer on top? Maybe i can thin it down too? I'm using Wattyl interior estapol ?

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what I picked up on was your intent to spray these boxes.

my experience with finishes is fairly limited, but what I've found is
apply any stain first -- if you use a sealer at this stage, limit it's use to areas where you want to control penetration of the stain

with a spray finish -- the only finish I've sprayed used tolulol (a benzene compound) as the solvent (it evaporates very rapidly, but you need a proper spray booth) -- you sand to the desired grit, about 180 or 240, then apply the finish. The first few coats fill the grain and after a scuff sand the next two or three give you the final finish.

if your using a brushed or wiped on finish, you typically typically need to use a sanding sealer or a grain filler after staining and before applyng the final finish.


what I don't really understand is your need to minimise the material cost a tad.
normally, material costs, especially the finish, is a very minor component of the cost of making an item.
The major component is your time, which at 50 cents per minute equates to $30 per hour -- which, after overheads, might leave you with a "wage" of $15 to $20 per hour.
I really don't see the point of trying to save a few cents of finish per box, unless you also save a few minutes per box.

[kroozzn62]

Thanks Ian.
basically ive got the product mostly pre cut and i just need to run a few rounds on the edges, nail/glue together and finish, Ive worked out that to start i need to replace my wages at the moment only, and with the cost of materials and approx the 38 hours ive given my self per week to build an amount of units and until i have a setup where i can cut my own board i cant lessen any other costs bar the material in my control which is the finishing.
The reason im so stringent is the competition with imports in the market and hoping to secure volume of orders to maintain on going orders, until my range expands and more profitable products are put on display.
Thank you for your insight to the method of hourly rate etc this is a new industry for me.
From furniture sales to production is quite different but id like to be apart of keeping Australian manufactures alive for the future.
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[ian]

Kroozzn'

I wont bore you wth the maths, but if you've been on wages (or salary) for a while, your employer has covered things like holiday pay, income protection (sick leave), payment for public holidays, and superannuation .

to merely "replace your wages", your hourly rate needs to increase by about 15% just to cover the annual leave and public holidays you'll no longer be paid for, plus a further 9% to cover the superannuation you now have to pay for yourself.
so if you're looking to "replace wages" of $20 per hour, you need to cost your time at about $25 per hour. (and this doesn't allow for buying income protection insurance, the time you need to do your accounting, sales and marketing)
If you can make 200 units in a 38 hour week, you have to sell them for $4.75 each just to make wages.
To that you have to add the material costs to reach the "break even" production cost.